BBC: United hold talks with Mourinho

[Revan]

Youth is part of the traditions of the club, some supporters (like me) enjoy seeing youth team players come through more than signing big names. You shouldn't be that surprised by this considering the clubs history is built around the busby babes etc. It's not about blindly supporting any young player that gets a shot. For me it's that it is better to at least start with positive intent and support them rather than knock them from the off.

For what it's worth I disagree with you on Lingard, I think he is going to make it. The jury is still out for me on McNair but again I'd rather support the lad than knock him from the get go. As I said earlier to @devilish, I remember him knocking P Nev in much the same way he is knocking McNair. I think most would agree P Nev was a great servant during his time here and had a decent career in the end.

As I say, I just don't think the default position on youth should be 'they aren't good enough'. The nature of a young player is that they probably aren't good enough. But it's much more rewarding as a supporter to at least give youth a chance and SUPPORT them I think. Every team has to have its journeymen. There's nothing wrong with that.

Traditions evolve. Or clubs become Liverpool.

Don't get me wrong, I would like to see us producing and then getting the benefit of young players as anyone else. But not to the hindrance of the team, which we have been doing recently.

We use Barca as example, but Barca doesn't waste time in donkeys as we do. They sent Gerard Deolofeu to Everton, despite that he is a better winger/attacking forward than anyone we have produced since Beckham. They give time only to the best of the best, and so at times produce top players. We give games to players who will probably won't make a career in EPL.

 

[Summit]

Indeed, I meant a good enough talent/potential quality player. The academies job isn't to give you a world class 20 year old. If it gives you a Januzaj or Pique, then it's done just fine. The manager then has to take that player to the level he can reach. In Pique's case, SAF chose Evans and Pep was the man to do that.

I wouldn't class him as our youth product though. Yeah he counts as home grown blah blah, but we signed him when he was like 17 years old, so most of his youth and training was done at barca. He is IMO their product.

 

[SteveJ]

It's going to be a bleedin' civil war on here should José struggle, with those who want to shag him on one side & those who believe he's Hitler without the charm on the other.

 

[pocco]

I am anything but a t.o.p red

You couldn't be any further away.

 

[Skills]

Actually at the time he wasn't. No way near Ferdinand's and Vidic's level. It's ok saying this in hindsight now we've seen him turn out to be world class, but the fact is he was no way better than what we had at the time.

You're never going to produce quality players for exactly the positions you need at the time. We can produce a World class GK in the next 5 years but it would be pointless, if De Gea wants to stay here for 10 or more years.

Doesn't mean we should just give up on the system though, because as long as there is a steady stream of talent coming through some will prove themselves to be very useful.

 

[devilish]

You couldn't be any further away.

As said

 

[Catt]

Ah screw this, I'm in. Just behave, Jose.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

No, it is not rubbish. Pique played 23 times for us, most of them from the bench. That is less than Jesse Lingard (in minutes).

Pogba played 7 times for us, all of them from the bench. That is less than Bebe.

They got poached from other clubs, spent some time on the academy, then a bit on the bench before they left and became world class players,

The only players who were really good enough to start for us since the class of 92, weren't ever given a chance. Instead, we lost time in Gibson, Cleverley and co.

If you disagree with what you said being rubbish at least bother to read the reason for said opinion. Players clearly being good enough for the team not being picked is not the problem of the academy. If you want someone to blame for those things then it's SAF or whoever handled them after. The academy did its job, and a good one at that.

Also, in addition to the above two being good enough, and not uitlized, oshea, brown and Fletcher were clearly good enough for Manchester United highlighted by their contribution to our most successful years. You can try to play it down by adding "to start for us" but it's a meaningless addition. They were good enough, they did contribute, they did start, and we won shitloads. Hence, good enough.

 

[Summit]

You're never going to produce quality players for exactly the positions you need at the time. We can produce a World class GK in the next 5 years but it would be pointless, if De Gea wants to stay here for 10 or more years.

Doesn't mean we should just give up on the system though, because as long as there is a steady stream of talent coming through some will prove themselves to be very useful.

Aye, I thought he was having a dig at us letting him go, I didn't realise he was meaning we produce good players. My mistake.

 

[JoaquinJoaquin]

Hope to god it's true but not getting excited until I see it on the Man Utd page.

 

[walkinhop]

It would be interesting to see Mourinho not under Perez or the Oligarch.

 

[K2K]

"Enamouring himself to the Chelsea fans"? He never said that he turned down Man United for Chelsea, did he?

Sir Alex said Jose had already told him that he was returning to Chelsea.

I'm not sure what to believe anymore.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

I wouldn't class him as our youth product though. Yeah he counts as home grown blah blah, but we signed him when he was like 17 years old, so most of his youth and training was done at barca. He is IMO their product.

We couldn't have signed had we not had an academy though. So he is someone the academy contributed to us being available to us (which we didn't utilise).

 

[Raul Madrid]

It would be interesting to see Mourinho not under Perez or the Oligarch.

Perez did not interfere with him at all. He gave him control over almost everything, and fired Valdano for him. Mourinho had far more control over at Madrid than any coach has had in recent years.

 

[SirAF]

Ah screw this, I'm in. Just behave, Jose.

Welcome to the dark side

 

[Dr. Funkenstein]

Ah screw this, I'm in. Just behave, Jose.

Little chance of that, misbehaving has been at the core of his management the last few years. It's gotten less and less about football and more and more about mind games and intimidation. Now he has lost his air of invincability there's not much left and he has become a clown with the same old jokes over and over again. He's on his way down and will take this club in the same direction.

 

[Revan]

If you disagree with what you said being rubbish at least bother to read the reason for said opinion. Players clearly being good enough for the team not being picked is not the problem of the academy. If you want someone to blame for those things then it's SAF or whoever handled them after. The academy did its job, and a good one at that.

Also, in addition to the above two being good enough, and not uitlized, oshea, brown and Fletcher were clearly good enough for Manchester United highlighted by their contribution to our most successful years. You can try to play it down by adding "to start for us" but it's a meaningless addition. They were good enough, they did contribute, they did start, and we won shitloads. Hence, good enough.

But they weren't players from our academy. They were players that we signed and we got. And ultimately, the only goal of the academy is to produce players for the first team. If that doesn't happen, then something is wrong with the approach.

I mentioned Fletch, O'Shea and Brown. 3 good squad players in 20 years. That is atrocious.

You started with the 'Rubbish' part.

 

[K2K]

A warning to all those excited by this maybe happening - Mourinho with unlimited power and Mendes in the background, is asking for big trouble. Do you want Jose making decisions to go with Mendes' 'recommendations', spending the club's money recklessly on dross - just like Mendes has done with Lim and Valencia? Doesn't this make any of you feel uneasy?

Jose will probably work in the very short term (I'm sure he'll be super motivated) - but it is foolish to not have a DOF or similar figure, who is there to ensure he is accountable for his actions.

I also cannot forget his actions re the dressing room and his medical staff at Chelsea, what was that all about???? This makes me real anxious.
Also forget about seeing a CBJ given a chance - not going to happen with Mo I don't think.

We are already deep in bed with Mendes though.

Just last year, Gill and Ferguson were guests at his wedding party. Then there's the Bebe saga which was dodgy as feck.

And Woodward is apparently a friend of Mendes too, and we've dealt extensively with Mendes agents in the past and continue to do so.

 

[Spoony]

Little chance of that, misbehaving has been at the core of his management the last few years. It's gotten less and less about football and more and more about mind games and intimidation. Now he has lost his air of invincability there's not much left and he has become a clown with the same old jokes over and over again. He's on his way down and will take this club in the same direction.

Can't go as low as LVG's United to be fair.

 

[Drainy]

Welbeck was never United level, or close to it. He was a manc though, which is all that matters for many people. He was a good athlete who was average or below average in pretty much every aspect of football.

Which is clearly why Arsene Wenger made him one of the 5 most expensive players in Arsenal's transfer history.

 

[Dr. Funkenstein]

Bitter? He'd have something else to concentrate on.




Can't go as low as LVG's United to be fair.

You didn't watch his Chelsea this season?

 

[Ramshock]

Perhaps people think 5 months of shite in a spectacularly successful 15 year career is not really that much of an issue.

That is a fair point Duffer, but we dont know if theres an issue with him. Thats my point.

 

[Robbie Boy]

23 pages in less than a day

 

[acnumber9]

Little chance of that, misbehaving has been at the core of his management the last few years. It's gotten less and less about football and more and more about mind games and intimidation. Now he has lost his air of invincability there's not much left and he has become a clown with the same old jokes over and over again. He's on his way down and will take this club in the same direction.

But you don't support Man United so it won't affect you. You'll be able to pick a new manager you support and follow that club.

 

[Spoony]

You didn't watch his Chelsea this season?

No, but I did watch the the seasons LVG was sacked at Bayern and Barcelona. Low? Very. Mourinho is the only man available to fix LVG's mess.

 

[Spoony]

But you don't support Man United so it won't affect you. You'll be able to pick a new manager you support and follow that club.

Whom does he support?

 

[acnumber9]

Whom does he support?

Van Gaal.

 

[Spoony]

Van Gaal.

Hmmm. He's certainly got his groupies.

 

[acnumber9]

Hmmm. He's certainly got his groupies.

He's said it before. He might have an actual club he supports but it certainly isn't Man United.

 

[Revan]

Which is clearly why Arsene Wenger made him one of the 5 most expensive players in Arsenal's transfer history.

And he has been doing oh so well for Arsenal.

And of course, Wenger is an astute manager when it comes to signing players, which can be proven both from the number of trophies he has been winning in the past decade, and from the quality of the young players he has signed.

 

[Shamwow]

Can't go as low as LVG's United to be fair.

Really?

 

[K2K]

People still not addressing this current Chelsea season I see.

The players failed him. He wasnt entirely blameless but the players really stopped trying.

Edin Hazard seems to subscribe to that notion too as he has come out today saying that he event sent Mourinho an sms apologizing for his poor form this season, and that he felt that he personally let him down.

Most managers have a blip at some point in their career. Even Van Gaal himself has after the disastrous spell he had with the Dutch NT and Barca . Sir Alex too was basically being written off in 2005/06. This is by far Jose's worst ever season, but like LvG and Sir Alex before him, it can be a great lesson for him, and one where he can improve through.

People are far too hasty in writing off managers.

 

[Spoony]

Really?

Yep. He'd have to be a magician of the dark arts variety to makes us as unwatchable as the great El Vee Gee.

 

[Randall Flagg]

The players failed him. He wasnt entirely blameless but the players really stopped trying.

Edin Hazard seems to subscribe to that notion too as he has come out today saying that he event sent Mourinho an sms apologizing for his poor form this season, and that he felt that he personally let him down.

Most managers have a blip at some point in their career. Even Van Gaal himself has after the disastrous spell he had with the Dutch NT and Barca . Sir Alex too was basically being written off in 2005/06. This is by far Jose's worst ever season, but like LvG and Sir Alex before him, it can be a great lesson for him, and one where he can improve through.

People are far too hasty in writing off managers.

Fergie never dropped anywhere near as low

 

[Dr. Funkenstein]

But you don't support Man United so it won't affect you. You'll be able to pick a new manager you support and follow that club.

My support for United is and has always been conditional, I wasn't born into it, I support them by choice. Never pretented anything else, but the conditions have been met since the early nineties, so it never really was a problem. But if the club changes what I loved about it, it will be a problem.

 

[17 Van der Gouw]

#mourinhoout

 

[Spoony]

My support for United is and has always been conditional, I wasn't born into it, I support them by choice. Never pretented anything else, but the conditions have been met since the early nineties, so it never really was a problem. But if the club changes what I loved about it, it will be a problem.

Do you actually support(fully) any club?

 

[izec]

I am anything but a t.o.p red

Are you sure? devilish = devil = red = t.o.p red

 

[acnumber9]

My support for United is and has always been conditional, I wasn't born into it, I support them by choice. Never pretented anything else, but the conditions have been met since the early nineties, so it never really was a problem. But if the club changes what I loved about it, it will be a problem.

That condition is Van Gaal as manager though isn't it? You only joined this site when he was appointed and your only real interest is in supporting him.

 

[MoBeats]

My support for United is and has always been conditional, I wasn't born into it, I support them by choice. Never pretented anything else, but the conditions have been met since the early nineties, so it never really was a problem. But if the club changes what I loved about it, it will be a problem.

What?