F1 2022 Season

[Hal9000]

Some fans do love deluding themselves huh. Just a bit of common sense needed. If Red bull had a new plank they have to run from Spa that made the car significantly slower why would they put it on Perez 3 races early and sacrifice so many points, and also hurt Max’s chances to win races?

Race data, set up tests, etc so that can dial it in/upgrade over the summer break. Its why you get lot of teams running one car with upgrades up and down the grid.

Plus if it was an upgrade.. wouldn't they put it on max car first? Again it's just speculation though. I just found a few things interesting that it was on Perez car, this was the first race he was slower than the Mercs... And they kept it on despite him being so far off the pace in practice.

We can just wait and see in Spa really. I do think Merc will win a race.. I think on race pace they are getting there.

 

[dinostar77]

To fair back.. Even if they change their floor i think Max will still be there or there abouts with the Mercs. Plus we'll get some bumpy street tracks that will probably bring Mercs bouncing back. I do think Merc/Lewis can beat the Ferrari's though, that's more to do with Ferrari reliability and wanting to sabotage themselves.

The proposed TD change for post belgium is supposedly will bring Mercedes slightly closer but it wont close a 0.5 second gap to Ferrari and 0.7 gap to Red Bull.

Mercedes will win a race this season, as others have said more likely because theres a dnf for the RBs and Ferraris.

Next seasons tech changes could change the pecking order and potentially bring Mercedes back to level pegging with RB and Ferrari.

 

[pauldyson1uk]

RedBull and Ferrari are going to make changes to their floors post belgium gp. They are the only two teams, fighting the new technical directive and any directives for floor changes for 2023 season. You wouldnt fight the TD that hard and threaten to take FIA to court if you didnt have serious performance loss with the TD.

Would appreciate any link to any articles that say Perez was running a new floor that complied with the TD. The rake of the car would need to change to comply with the TD as the front 25% of the plank cant wear down more that 1mm across the x/y axis therefore cant rake the rear suspension as high as usual. I didnt notice this during the gp. So as i said any links would be appreciated.

I have looked and I cant find any thing really, just a couple of posts on other forums, with just speculation, nothing official.
I am leaning to @hobbers and his explanation, I dont think they would sacrifice so many points, running it before they had too.
Nobody mention a new floor on Sky, I am sure they would if they noticed anything.

 

[dinostar77]

Theres nothing on autosport f1 or on The-race.com about a new floor compiling with the TD on perez car. Perez was running different floor edging to max in the fp sessions but thats a completely different kettle of fish.

 

[hobbers]

RedBull and Ferrari are going to make changes to their floors post belgium gp. They are the only two teams, fighting the new technical directive and any directives for floor changes for 2023 season. You wouldnt fight the TD that hard and threaten to take FIA to court if you didnt have serious performance loss with the TD.

This is wrong. Only Ferrari are bothered about the Spa technical directive on the plank. Horner said Red Bull dont care about it.

What they do care about, along with 6 other teams, are the proposed changes for 2023 which have seemingly been designed to favour Mercedes at the expense of the rest of the grid.

 

[laughtersassassin]

The proposed TD change for post belgium is supposedly will bring Mercedes slightly closer but it wont close a 0.5 second gap to Ferrari and 0.7 gap to Red Bull.

Mercedes will win a race this season, as others have said more likely because theres a dnf for the RBs and Ferraris.

Next seasons tech changes could change the pecking order and potentially bring Mercedes back to level pegging with RB and Ferrari.

Where you getting the idea that Red bull are two tenths faster than Ferrari? If anything Ferrari are quicker but they just feck up half the races.

 

[laughtersassassin]

RedBull and Ferrari are going to make changes to their floors post belgium gp. They are the only two teams, fighting the new technical directive and any directives for floor changes for 2023 season. You wouldnt fight the TD that hard and threaten to take FIA to court if you didnt have serious performance loss with the TD.

Would appreciate any link to any articles that say Perez was running a new floor that complied with the TD. The rake of the car would need to change to comply with the TD as the front 25% of the plank cant wear down more that 1mm across the x/y axis therefore cant rake the rear suspension as high as usual. I didnt notice this during the gp. So as i said any links would be appreciated.

Yeah you got your info wrong.

Officially speaking Red Bull are making no changes for the floor for the TD in Spa. Horner already said they don't care about that TD and they are fine with it. It was only rumours early on saying Red Bull where opposing it. So as far as anyone actually knows this has no effect on them.

Also 6 teams are against the 2023 changes and rightly so considering the rumours in the 2023 changes are quite similar to a Merc suggestion of how to fix the issues that doesn't even exist.

 

[sun_tzu]

Yeah you got your info wrong.

Officially speaking Red Bull are making no changes for the floor for the TD in Spa. Horner already said they don't care about that TD and they are fine with it. It was only rumours early on saying Red Bull where opposing it. So as far as anyone actually knows this has no effect on them.

Also 6 teams are against the 2023 changes and rightly so considering the rumours in the 2023 changes are quite similar to a Merc suggestion of how to fix the issues that doesn't even exist.

Ferrari... (plus their engine customers Alfa R + Haas)
Red Bull (plus their junior team Alpha T)
who is the 6th?... Alpine?

 

[hobbers]

Ferrari... (plus their engine customers Alfa R + Haas)
Red Bull (plus their junior team Alpha T)
who is the 6th?... Alpine?

Everyone except the shitbox teams who fecked up their designs - Mercedes, McLaren and AM.

Williams are also against the proposed changes for 2023 because they are so extensive it's pretty much a whole new philosophy, and they wont be able to afford the R&D.

 

[dinostar77]

Ferrari... (plus their engine customers Alfa R + Haas)
Red Bull (plus their junior team Alpha T)
who is the 6th?... Alpine?

Williams. Who are also the only team on the grid blocking hamiltons diversity plan to have more BAME incorporated into F1.

 

[dinostar77]

Yeah you got your info wrong.

Officially speaking Red Bull are making no changes for the floor for the TD in Spa. Horner already said they don't care about that TD and they are fine with it. It was only rumours early on saying Red Bull where opposing it. So as far as anyone actually knows this has no effect on them.

Also 6 teams are against the 2023 changes and rightly so considering the rumours in the 2023 changes are quite similar to a Merc suggestion of how to fix the issues that doesn't even exist.

I will agree to disagree as we know both ferrari and RB have flexible floors and both will be illegal after spa.

https://formula1news.co.uk/red-bull...jor-blow-as-fia-clamp-down-on-illegal-floors/

https://formula1news.co.uk/wolff-br...r-as-fia-rule-them-illegal-after-austrian-gp/

 

[The Firestarter]

Williams. Who are also the only team on the grid blocking hamiltons diversity plan to have more BAME incorporated into F1.

How's that even relevant to the aero issues?

 

[dinostar77]

How's that even relevant to the aero issues?

Its not, read my sentence again properly. I used the word "also".

Williams are going out of their way to annoy their engine supplier. Either because they are skint. Or they dont agree with Mercedes on these issues.

 

[laughtersassassin]

I will agree to disagree as we know both ferrari and RB have flexible floors and both will be illegal after spa.

https://formula1news.co.uk/red-bull...jor-blow-as-fia-clamp-down-on-illegal-floors/

https://formula1news.co.uk/wolff-br...r-as-fia-rule-them-illegal-after-austrian-gp/

You don't know that for a fact. All speculation.

All we know is what Ferrari and Red Bull say.

Ferrari have said they have to change floor for Spa to comply.

Red Bull have said they don't have to change and don't care about the TD. Obviously you don't have to believe them but that's the only official info anyone has.

 

[dinostar77]

You don't know that for a fact. All speculation.

We will know for a fact after spa. As any floor, and suspension geometry changes will be listed for the dutch gp weekend.

Or before then ask yourself, why for past few GP, have RB been testing a floor with perez and not max in fp1 where they have been playing around with the edging of the floor (where the vortices help seal the floor?).

Its already the best car on the grid, with no porposing. Budgets are limited yet alot of time and effort is now being spent on the floor edging. Hmmmm......

 

[laughtersassassin]

We will know for a fact after spa. As any floor, and suspension geometry changes will be listed for the dutch gp weekend.

Or before then ask yourself, why for past few GP, have RB been testing a floor with perez and not max in fp1 where they have been playing around with the edging of the floor (where the vortices help seal the floor?).

Its already the best car on the grid, with no porposing. Budgets are limited yet alot of time and effort is now being spent on the floor edging. Hmmmm......

The TD is not related to the floor fences at all which is what Red Bull have been actively changing....

Why do any teams change their design. Trying to improve, trying to get more downforce etc etc.

There is just as much chance this effects other teams as there was never confirmation Red bull are the 2nd team. Only rumours. Again it might be true but that's not the point. Really the point is how so many people run with rumours assuming they are true off zero info.

 

[hobbers]

You don't know that for a fact. All speculation.

All we know is what Ferrari and Red Bull say.

Ferrari have said they have to change floor for Spa to comply.

Red Bull have said they don't have to change and don't care about the TD. Obviously you don't have to believe them but that's the only official info anyone has.

How dare you challenge the gospel according to Toto.

 

[Adam-Utd]

About the floor debate;

I don't think Perez's design would actually look any different, it's just stiffer and flexes less? I don't see how anybody outside of the team would know it was different.

 

[dinostar77]

The TD is not related to the floor fences at all which is what Red Bull have been actively changing....

Why do any teams change their design. Trying to improve, trying to get more downforce etc etc.

There is just as much chance this effects other teams as there was never confirmation Red bull are the 2nd team. Only rumours. Again it might be true but that's not the point. Really the point is how so many people run with rumours assuming they are true off zero info.

If you cant run the rake that RB currently do through the rear suspension because plank wear after spa has to be uniform across the length and width of the plank at no more than 1mm. Then what do you do? You loose the flexi floor and the 6mm of plank movement you had at spa and before.

Therefore you need to use the edge flooring to seal the floor in a way that makes up for the loss of the flexi floor and rake.

Hence the comprehensive testing. Theres a reason why this TD got pushed back to post spa rather than post French gp. To give ferrari and RB time to develop a new solution that fits within the TD.

They are the only two teams with the flexi floors. They wont loose much performance maybe its alledged up to 0.030 of a second. Thats not even 0.1 of a second.

 

[laughtersassassin]

If you cant run the rake that RB currently do through the rear suspension because plank wear after spa has to be uniform across the length and width of the plank at no more than 1mm. Then what do you do? You loose the flexi floor and the 6mm of plank movement you had at spa and before.

Therefore you need to use the edge flooring to seal the floor in a way that makes up for the loss of the flexi floor and rake.

Hence the comprehensive testing. Theres a reason why this TD got pushed back to post spa rather than post French gp. To give ferrari and RB time to develop a new solution that fits within the TD.

They are the only two teams with the flexi floors. They wont loose much performance maybe its alledged up to 0.030 of a second. Thats not even 0.1 of a second.

Yes that's a theory but not a known fact. Again we only know Ferrari are changing as they have said they have to.

Red bull are adamant they are changing nothing and this TD doesn't effect their current design at all.

Maybe they are lying maybe they aren't. But as I said it's all a rumour to this point.

 

[avgp_1]

The Technical Directive won't make much impact if any with respect to performance. I see the status quo remain post Spa.

However I don't see RedBull as being up there with pace of Ferrari anymore, Ferrari are clearly with the advantage if they could sort out their issues. They need to grab a few 1-2s going into the power tracks to bring Leclerc back into this.

 

[Jack-C20]

Still early days but interesting looking forecast on the weekend. Will make a change from the roasting temperatures they’ve got at the minute.

 

[laughtersassassin]

The Technical Directive won't make much impact if any with respect to performance. I see the status quo remain post Spa.

However I don't see RedBull as being up there with pace of Ferrari anymore, Ferrari are clearly with the advantage if they could sort out their issues. They need to grab a few 1-2s going into the power tracks to bring Leclerc back into this.

Agreed on the Ferrari being the fastest car now. Pace wise over a lap they really seem to be extending the gap to Red Bull but they just can't get it together on race day due to their mistakes.

I expect Hungary to be dominant for them unless they bin it or explode of course

 

[pauldyson1uk]

Still early days but interesting looking forecast on the weekend. Will make a change from the roasting temperatures they’ve got at the minute.

very interesting, still warm but Saturday Thunderstorms 70%, could disrupt Qualifying
Sunday looks like it will be dry.

 

[dinostar77]

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/first-details-of-porsches-f1-buy-in-of-red-bull-revealed/10344245/

https://the-race.com/formula-1/porsche-plans-to-buy-50-of-red-bulls-f1-operation/

PORSCHE PLANS TO BUY 50% OF RED BULL’S F1 OPERATION

 

[pauldyson1uk]

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/first-details-of-porsches-f1-buy-in-of-red-bull-revealed/10344245/

https://the-race.com/formula-1/porsche-plans-to-buy-50-of-red-bulls-f1-operation/

PORSCHE PLANS TO BUY 50% OF RED BULL’S F1 OPERATION

I am shocked at this, not that Porsche are entering F1, but I thought they would enter has a new team , not on the back of an established team.
Can only be good for RB

 

[slyadams]

Yes that's a theory but not a known fact. Again we only know Ferrari are changing as they have said they have to.

Red bull are adamant they are changing nothing and this TD doesn't effect their current design at all.

Maybe they are lying maybe they aren't. But as I said it's all a rumour to this point.

Dishonesty and disingenuity are Horner's default settings. Honestly if that guy told me the sun was hot I'd start questioning everything I thought I knew.

 

[mitChley]

Vettell retiring.

What a driver and what a human, hope he stays on our TVs.

 

[JamesB__]

I’m not surprised but still gutted. Shame he had to spend his final two seasons in such a joke of a team.

Hope he sticks around in some capacity, he’d be absolutely brilliant on the Sky team but that ain’t gonna happen.

 

[pauldyson1uk]

BREAKING: Sebastian Vettel has announced he is retiring from Formula One at the end of the 2022 season

Not shocked to be honest, he does seem rather disillusioned with the sport at the moment.

 

[Leg-End]

What a great career though, I did not like the fella at Red Bull but I can appreciate his talent and I think he's going to do a lot of good for the world outside of his career. One of the good guys of F1.

 

[SilentWitness]

Understandable. Unlike Hamilton, who also has avid interests outside the sport, he doesn't have a team capable of winning a title next season so it makes sense for him to retire and focus on those other bits and bobs. Good bloke. Hated him at Red Bull and he's turned into one of my favourites on the grid. Will miss him.

 

[pauldyson1uk]

 

[F-Red]

Vettel and a blown diffuser was a historically powerful combination. Shame to see him go, but its very clear he's not enjoying running in the midfield and his statement around perfection is something that will take a long time to achieve at Aston Martin.

It'll be interesting whether Aston recruit experience or go for one of the next gen drivers.

 

[altodevil]

Top driver - sad to see him leave, and a bit shit how it ended at that plastic team.

 

[pauldyson1uk]

I never liked him , hated that Finger when he won, but that changed over the years, funny guy on TV.
Hopefully Sky will give him a presenters stint, maybe FIA could use him has some sort of ambassador.

 

[Robertd0803]

Vettel really never was the same again after the crash in Germany when he was leading in 2018. Showed the odd flash here and there but you could tell that broke him. He made a massive amount of wheel to wheel errors afterwards and really wasnt the same afterwards.

I can see why hes going, hes young enough still to do something else and why waste more years driving an car that wont challenge and is mid table at best.

He will be a massive loss as a personality though.

Couldnt tolerate him at Red Bull, but he went up massively in my eyes when he was the first over to congratulate Hamilton in Turkey in 2020. Class act.

 

[Robertd0803]

I never liked him , hated that Finger when he won, but that changed over the years, funny guy on TV.
Hopefully Sky will give him a presenters stint, maybe FIA could use him has some sort of ambassador.

The FIA would never have him as an ambassador, he would be too quick to call them out on their bullshit.

 

[pauldyson1uk]

https://fb.watch/ey8X4rKASv/

 

[pauldyson1uk]

The FIA would never have him as an ambassador, he would be too quick to call them out on their bullshit.

very true.