Well, look at those players from the Aberdeen side that won the Cup winners cup against Real Madrid. Sir Alex had a pool of 23 players for the season, and 12 of them averaged between 58-60 games in that season. Yet we complain about playing in the Europa Cup a few days after a Premier league game and vice-versa.
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Well, look at those players from the Aberdeen side that won the Cup winners cup against Real Madrid. Sir Alex had a pool of 23 players for the season, and 12 of them averaged between 58-60 games in that season. Yet we complain about playing in the Europa Cup a few days after a Premier league game and vice-versa.
I’m pretty sure the game is more demanding than it was in the 80s.
How about David Beckham? He was fit, but in his line of work, he didn't really need to run fast or far, since his crossing was as accurate as you would want as a striker. Again, you can be fit as anything, but if you are against a player who has a sublime technique, then it would be for nothing.
Don’t know what your point is.
If it is, what does it prove? The Premier league players of today are a great deal fitter than they were in the 1970s and 1980s. Other players from other European countries are a great deal fitter than the premier leagues players, just as they were in the 1970s and 1980s. Didn't stop Nottingham Forest being the last English club to win back to back European Cups or Liverpool having there streak of European Cups.
You do, you are just ignoring it. In fact, I will put it to you again. David Beckham could have been unfit, but as far as his technique was concerned, it was first class. Get the picture?
A major part of this evolution is the improvements in sports science. Players are faster/stronger/fitter now than ever before because we have a far better understanding of diet and optimum training.
How is the current Barca side unfitter than the one in 08-12? Tactically they aren't set up to play the same ultra high press win the ball within 7 seconds style as under Guardiola but the team still contains half the same players.
If you're going to make an accurate comparison you'd look at AC Milan vs the best sides in Europe and not Juan Mata. I'd bet quite heavily on today's Barca/Bayern/Madrid taking that team apart.
Any link to that statement?
It's not only English players that were more unfit than current English players. This applies to the game in general.
What does it prove? It was an answer to your comment on how we shouldn't complain having only a couple of days between matches because 12 of Aberdeen's players averaged 58-60 (haven't fact checked that) games a season.
Because the game is more demanding than it was in the 80s, the complaints of matches being too close to each other, are valid.
If they are superfit as some are implying, then it shouldn't be a problem. Furthermore, how can you say categorically that in those days they were "unfit"? What is your definition of being "fit" and "unfit"? Remember the days of running around for 90 minutes when no substitutions were allowed, 42 games per season not including other trophies. Todays players do NOT have an excuse for being UNFIT. That is why Rooney should be out of the club sharp.
No I really don't. I replied to an argument saying that Mata not being as fit as Gullit/Rijkaard were somehow proves that the sport itself is not more physically demanding than it was in the early 90s.
So no, don't understand what Beckham being a great player despite not needing to be superfit (I disagree that he didn't need to run fast or far btw) has to do with my argument.
It's in his book. Said his father was quite a heavy drinker so he kind of despised getting drunk. Said he celebrated winning a scudetto (with Milan iirc) by getting drunk and remembered in the morning why he had been drunk perhaps only once before that in his life.
Anyway, I asked you a question earlier, what is your definition of "fit" and "unfit", because you use it like you are talking about someone who smokes 40 per day or eats hamburgers and thus excessively overweight. Robert Prosinečki smoked 40 a day, Johan Cruyff made the game magic in spite of his 20 a day habit, Zizou too, Maradona and even David Ginola.
I agree 100%. Don't what we've been arguing about. The whole point was that players today can't really afford heavy drinking during the season, because the game is super-demanding nowaday.
I agree, but as humans, we evolve with the time and our bodies adapt. Being a superfit footballer doesn't make for a brilliant goalscorer ref: Josef Bican who in his day scored over 1,400 goals in 950+ games.
Didn't he even cut out butter on his toast or something like that? I'm not a big Rooney fan but heck I would like him to do well but its sad that he shared a dressing room with Ronaldo and Giggs and could not take a leaf out if their book.
Ah well I guess his agent knows better than Zlatan himself... Yeah he probably doesn't anymore. One of the reasons why he's fit to play at the highest level at 35 years of age. Again, a point you agreed with.
Who argued that superfit footballer would automatically be a brilliant goalscorer?!? Of course not.
It was sleeping with his brothers wife that kept him so young looking....
BOOM
That's clearly not the case. The post right above yours disagrees with that along with many more.
You're preaching to the converted.
I don't agree with the rabid reaction to him having a few too many but in terms of wanting him out of the club I'd wager I was on that before yourself.
great post pex!
Don't really know where to start. I didn't say all footballers drink, so no need to bring up the Zlatan and Ronaldo example. A hundred others already have anyway.
Neither did I say coked up boxers were role models.
Bolt was out for four consecutive nights in London, going home with a number of girls every evening. There's plenty of pictures. Watch any documentary on him and while he trains hard he enjoys his downtime. As you say his diet was questionable as well. I love him for it, think he's great.
The point is that the very best athletes do this, they don't always live by this strict code you and others want them to. They're human. This isn't a phenomena owned by Wayne Rooney.
Bolt won gold in London in 100m, 200m & relay. If Rooney played great every match, scored 30 a season and assisted 20, I'd have no problem with what he did in his spare time. And once again, I don't think Bolt drank himself drunk any of those nights in London. Alcohol decreases one's performance immensely.
Will be peak if England put him to pasture before us. I think I would cry.
To be fair to Bolt he went partying after he'd won his gold medals in Brazil. I love Bolt as well, and from what I know of him, once it's training and competition time, he gets serious. He parties very hard but only after he achieves all his goals first.
"Will be peak" or "Will he peak"? Could you rephrase the question please mate @Adisa.
The urban dictionary beckons you, friend.
So, there was a 3rd possibility? So, to translate it would be, "It would be terrible should England retire him before we have a chance to do so." Am I doing this right?
@Pexbo got it spot on above. The time we can finally move this fat, money grabbing, over weight, over the hill guy out of our club, will be the day we can finally move forward post fergie. I hope Mourinho has got the balls to do what needs to be done. However I also think Mou has lost his edge
Sometimes.
Compared to being out without getting hammered, most of the times.
So by that equation, Rooney slept with a granny and that is why he is aging?It was sleeping with his brothers wife that kept him so young looking....
Totally agree, mate. The pro-Rooney Ihni binni dimi diniwiny anitaime are going to just love your post!!
What I'm trying to say is guys like Romario, Laudrup were still exceptional football specimens who would be electric in the modern game (that is just a random pair of players).. and someone like Mata heck even Messi, they're not ultra fit modern day footballers. Messi of this year is not the fittest he has ever been, yet he's still comfortably the best footballer on the planet.
That tells me that quality still trumps fitness.. if it was all about fitness, then Ronaldo would be the best player in the world. Quality players who are not super super fit but just normal level of fit for a professional footballer, can still more than hold their own in the modern game if they have the football brain and skills in their locker.
So this concept of a ultrafit modern team completely thrashing a top top team from the late 80's and early 90's seems unrealistic to me because quality wise that Milan team or Barca team from that period had top class footballers who I would still back against teams from this era.
Overall fitness has definitely improved, I never said it hadn't but I think people overstate the condition of todays players to the past when comparing the quality of the elite teams to the elite teams of that era.
Someone said Barca 2016 as fit as Barca 2009? no chance, Messi was much more fitter and faster then.. he was pressing alot more, beating players more, scoring more.. his general output in terms of effort was more. Iniesta was fitter then, the amount Xavi would run in games is alot more than Rakitic, Dani Alves was covering insane amount of ground.. this current side conserves energy more than that team did.
The United team of the 90's ran more than this current United side does.
Football like any sport goes through peaks and troughs.. fitness of players doesn't consistently get better year after year, there are times when it goes backwards before it goes forwards again. Overall I would say football is getting faster paced, players on the whole are definitely getting fitter but that doesn't mean every season this is happening.. last season alot of the elite EPL teams were in decline and covering less ground than they had in yesteryear.
Of course not all best footballers are the fittest ones always, no. Some players have more talent than others. With all the injuries and being 29, I’m sure Messi’s been in a better condition before, yes.
I replied to the fact that you used a pretty random comparison (Mata vs Gullit/Rijkaard) to prove a point that footballers are not fitter today than they were in the early 90s. Never said quality wouldn’t trump fitness. Although fitness is a big part of quality. I’d say all (except Higuain) the best players nowadays are super fit, Ronaldo is one of a kind on an ever higher level.
Personally I never said that modern team would ”completely trash a top top team such as Milan 88-92 or so”. Yes, Iniesta was in a better shape 6yrs ago. Quite logical really, 26-year old compared to a 32-year old. Perhaps the Barca of 2010-11 was fitter than today’s is, perhaps not. Even if they were, 2010 is still modern age. So them having a less fit team today doesn’t prove that players from the 90s were as fit as modern era players are. They had different type of players compared to what they have now.
Conserving energy and making the ball do the work is one of the first things I learned as a footballer. With the amount of matches during a season, it’s only smart to conserve energy as much as possible.
Absolutely not, fitness in football doesn’t go up year after year. In general though, I think footballers are in a better condition than they were during earlier eras. You simply can’t drink heavily during the season and expect to keep up with your peers. Rooney’s last couple of seasons are a good example of that. Don’t know exactly how much alcohol he’s consumed, talking about his fitness, discipline and commitment in general.
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