Westminster Politics

[ThehatchetMan]

While it's a huge amount we won't pay-off anything like the £50 billion deficit as no country does in reality. It's far easier just to wait for the currency to depreciate and for it to become meaningless in 10 years or so. The lenders don't look at values, but at percentages of GDP because of that. It'll be a tough few years though, as it needs to stay static at the least.

What baffles me is we've had 12 years of austerity and our national debt has went from 60% of GDP to 100%. A whopping 2.5 Trillion.

So how has our debt climbed so much after a decade of "feeling the pinch" and watching our national services crumble in front of our own eyes.

@sun_tzu - Any explanation for our national debt sky rocketing under this tory government and public services being the worst they've been in modern history? Where's all the tax payers money going? It's not as if it's a government that's renowned for improving any of our public services. So if the tory's have got us into so much more debt, what for? What's been achieved or gained?

Or is it just a case of that we can't trust them with tax payers money. Because the current evidence is pretty damning.

 

[Jippy]

Hills not fancying Hancock's chances...unless it's eating kangaroo penis.

I’m A Celebrity… Get Me Out Of Here! – Winner:

Jill Scott	10/3
Mike Tindall	9/2
Boy George	11/2
Olivia Attwood	11/2
Chris Moyles	11/2
Owen Warner	8/1
Matt Hancock	10/1
BAR	10/1

Matt Hancock Specials:

To Contest The First Publicly Voted Bushtucker Trial That He Is Available To Vote For:	1/3
To Be Eliminated At First Opportunity By The Public	7/1
To Quit The Jungle At Any Time After Entering:	3/1

 

[Ady87]

Was Hancock's seat at risk or safe? Wondering if he's going this route as he's expecting to be ousted at the next GE. Isn't his book out this week or soon?

 

[Sweet Square]

Politics is show business for the ugly.

Regardless of political party, there are so many politicians who are willing to kill thousands of people in order to get gunged by Ant & Dec.

 

[ThehatchetMan]

Was Hancock's seat at risk or safe? Wondering if he's going this route as he's expecting to be ousted at the next GE. Isn't his book out this week or soon?

Nah he's in a safe seat.

Just like most of the "minorities" in the tory party. They get strategically placed on seats which have only voted tory for the best part of a century. A sheep could wear a blue rosette and win Sunaks seat. They then try to use these "minority" sell-outs to potray themselves as a party for all with equality and opportunities.

But you throw Patel, Braverman, Sunak, Zahawi etc.. into a swing seat and they won't be a MP much longer. It's also why the tory's usually get these members to do their dirty work because they know that no matter how terrible they are as human beings, their seat is safe under all circumstances.

 

[sun_tzu]

What baffles me is we've had 12 years of austerity and our national debt has went from 60% of GDP to 100%. A whopping 2.5 Trillion.

So how has our debt climbed so much after a decade of "feeling the pinch" and watching our national services crumble in front of our own eyes.

@sun_tzu - Any explanation for our national debt sky rocketing under this tory government and public services being the worst they've been in modern history? Where's all the tax payers money going? It's not as if it's a government that's renowned for improving any of our public services. So if the tory's have got us into so much more debt, what for? What's been achieved or gained?

Or is it just a case of that we can't trust them with tax payers money. Because the current evidence is pretty damning.

For me the issue stems from 2008 austerity - it should possibly have been deeper but with tax rises as well to get on top of the deficit quickly and stsrt paying back debt before interests rates climbed

we didnt then chucked a load of covid debt on and then interest rates rocketed

we would have been in a much better place if we had cut deeper, taxed more got the defecit to zero around 2011, 2012 and been paying debt back for a decade ... I mentioned this in 2015


https://www.redcafe.net/threads/uk-...overall-majority.400059/page-27#post-17302633

In fairness they hardly ever talk about the debt (the amount we owe in total)- only the deficit (the amount the debt is increasing by)
Nobody has announced any plans to pay down the debt (the annual interest of which is more than our entire defence budget per year) - the austerity plans are only to get the books (eventually) balanced.

I'd be happy with a straight 25% tax on basic wages and 50% on higher earnings if the extra revenue went on paying back the debt and securing a more prosperous future for my sons generation (and im a higher rate tax payer - but not one who would fall into the proposed 50% at 150k).

As far as I can see there is no party talking about paying back the actual debt that I can vote for on this occasion.

I very much would fall into the 150K plus now and would be happy to see the tax rates I outlined if again accompanies with the measures needed to get on top of debt

25% basic tax, 50% higher rate... i think these are the kind of figures needed to plug the current gap and would still need to be accompanied by other taxes (windfall tax, pension contrribution changes, non dom arrangements) and will still require austerity deeper than before if we are to finally get on top of the deficit and start paying back some of the debt which personally i still think is the best thing for the long term future though i doubt any political party has the balls for it

 

[Jippy]

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[finneh]

Surely being left wing economically is actually using the taxes to improve public services and health care, look after the elderly and vulnerable and provide a better quality of living.

I'm not sure if you can call them left wing economically when they're systematically robbing our taxes and then diverting that money back out of the system into the hands of tory donors.

If we're being taxed so much more as you suggest then you'd expect public services to improve but everything is worse.

Furlough was a disgraceful scheme too. How many people have struggled on the ludicrous amounts we get for JSA the last decade. And all of a sudden the gov could pay people 30k a year to sit at home and do feck all. Ridiculous poorly thought out scheme. Should have been capped at minimum wage. Especially given Alot of those on furlough were out working earning extra money on top.

Left wing economics of taxing more and spending more doesn't necessarily correlate with having better public services, although that's clearly an overall goal. However whilst there are specific examples of tax money being diverted to tony donors (e.g. emegency covid procurement), the bulk of funding over the last 12 years has been focused on the lowest deciles in truth. You can tax more and waste more however, in fact some would argue this is an intrinsic characteristic of government spend. You can tax more as a % and stifle growth meaning you get less tax money in (see Ireland's corporation tax rate providing far more for their exchequer). You can tax more and use it for other means that aren't seen specifically as a public service (defence, HS2, furlough, bounce back loans, student loans, quangos etc) or you can tax to fill black holes due to interest rate rises or changes in societal structure (e.g. aging population, more student numbers, more people out of work etc).

Taking as red that borrowing simply isn't feasible for the foreseeable (for either tax cuts or spending increases) given the last several weeks then there's really only three choices: large and consistent tax rises protecting only the poorest, an acceptance of worse services for everyone, or a change in who public money is spent on. For example is paying £10k a year to a pensioner who has decent private provision already really a good use of funds or should pension payments be tapered? Should the taxpayer be subsiding GP appointments and prescriptions for the top few deciles? Should the top few deciles get access to student loans when they coud borrow at commercial rates?

These choices will only be made harder with an aging population irrespective of who's in charge. It'll be interesting to see both parties manifesto's for 2024 in truth as I don't think either will be seen as a credible option (ala Corbyn) if they simply say they'll be investing more money in public services, green energy, infrastructure etc and that paying for it will be anything but incredibly painful for everyone.

For me the issue stems from 2008 austerity - it should possibly have been deeper but with tax rises as well to get on top of the deficit quickly and stsrt paying back debt before interests rates climbed

we didnt then chucked a load of covid debt on and then interest rates rocketed

we would have been in a much better place if we had cut deeper, taxed more got the defecit to zero around 2011, 2012 and been paying debt back for a decade ... I mentioned this in 2015

I very much would fall into the 150K plus now and would be happy to see the tax rates I outlined if again accompanies with the measures needed to get on top of debt

25% basic tax, 50% higher rate... i think these are the kind of figures needed to plug the current gap and would still need to be accompanied by other taxes (windfall tax, pension contrribution changes, non dom arrangements) and will still require austerity deeper than before if we are to finally get on top of the deficit and start paying back some of the debt which personally i still think is the best thing for the long term future though i doubt any political party has the balls for it

I agree with this but clearly it goes back even further to the growth busting increases of spending during 2003 - 2008. When you have an economy growing by 2.5 - 5% per annum you can't be increasing spending by 5 - 7%. When your economy is growing this quickly it's so much easier to reduce both debt and deficit without those cuts being experienced on the ground. The fact that we were running a budget deficit between 2003 - 2008 was ludicrous given the growth. It's especially ludicrous because in 2001 our spend to GDP was around 35% whilst growth over the next 6 years was average 2.5% per year, however at the end of the period spend was over 40%. We should have had a large sovereign wealth fund in 2008 that could be spent to tackle the recession, which along with a small amount of debt would have seen us through (a small amount which could have been paid off 2010-2020).

As you allude to however the cuts during the Cameron-Osborne years never came close to returing spend to the 35% GDP level we saw in 2001. In fact so called "austerity" didn't reduce spend to GDP at all, it merely returned spending from a recession driven high back down to what Gordon Brown was spending (c. 40%).

 

[Jippy]

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[littlepeasoup]

Do young people watch I'm a Celebrity? Isn't it mainly middle age tossers in bumfeck Shropshire who've never been 10 miles from where they were born?

 

[Sweet Square]

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[littlepeasoup]

It's been said before, but I'll say it again... who the *feck* does not know how they feel about sending refugees to Rwanda?! How much of a cloistered closeted life must you lead to have absolutely no opinion on that one way or the other. Beige fecks.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

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My maths might be a bit shitty that those percentages suggest they asked more Tory voters than Labour or Lib Dem ones.

 

[Smores]

2022 and we've still got people citing austerity as the correct way forward.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

2022 and we've still got people citing austerity as the correct way forward.

I like how it's being phrased as if the last austerity phase ended.

 

[Foxbatt]

Where is Private Pike these days?

 

[nimic]

And then there this Cnut trying to make himself famous again:

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Is it just me or is that just a spectacularly bad cover? What's wrong with his face (beyond the obvious)? Bad cut-out?

 

[SalfordRed18]

Isn't it more of a hate crime than terrorist attack?

Do you still consider it more of a hate crime now that counter terrorism police are getting involved? Genuine question.

 

[CassiusClaymore]

Is it just me or is that just a spectacularly bad cover? What's wrong with his face (beyond the obvious)? Bad cut-out?

Looks like someone has done a piss poor job of airbrushing his jowls out.

Who the feck is going to buy this anyway? Actually, I might get it for my brother for Xmas (sale price only). Being a Tory, he'll love it.

 

[Maticmaker]

It's been said before, but I'll say it again... who the *feck* does not know how they feel about sending refugees to Rwanda?! How much of a cloistered closeted life must you lead to have absolutely no opinion on that one way or the other. Beige fecks.

Perhaps the 'Don't Knows' think that it's a choice between Rwanda and Disney world.... now that's a hard one!

 

[FireballXL5]

I like how it's being phrased as if the last austerity phase ended.

“If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face—for ever.”
― George Orwell

 

[Drawfull]

Is it just me or is that just a spectacularly bad cover? What's wrong with his face (beyond the obvious)? Bad cut-out?

Agree. It's like a Photoshop my dad would do (sorry, dad).

 

[Adisa]

Do you still consider it more of a hate crime now that counter terrorism police are getting involved? Genuine question.

I don't know. And i don't even know what the legal bar is for an act to be classed as terrorism, that's why I asked.
What classifies an incident as terrorist?

 

[ThehatchetMan]

For me the issue stems from 2008 austerity - it should possibly have been deeper but with tax rises as well to get on top of the deficit quickly and stsrt paying back debt before interests rates climbed

we didnt then chucked a load of covid debt on and then interest rates rocketed

we would have been in a much better place if we had cut deeper, taxed more got the defecit to zero around 2011, 2012 and been paying debt back for a decade ... I mentioned this in 2015


https://www.redcafe.net/threads/uk-...overall-majority.400059/page-27#post-17302633


I very much would fall into the 150K plus now and would be happy to see the tax rates I outlined if again accompanies with the measures needed to get on top of debt

25% basic tax, 50% higher rate... i think these are the kind of figures needed to plug the current gap and would still need to be accompanied by other taxes (windfall tax, pension contrribution changes, non dom arrangements) and will still require austerity deeper than before if we are to finally get on top of the deficit and start paying back some of the debt which personally i still think is the best thing for the long term future though i doubt any political party has the balls for it

So I think you could agree then that this Tory government isn't capable in the slightest of resolving the financial issues we're facing right now. The proof is in the pudding so to speak.

And then to add on top of that Brexit which has crippled the economy further and then Liz Truss blowing a big hole in the economy too.

And then the billions wasted on furtbough and ppe contracts.

And despite all this inequality continues to grow. The wealthy get wealthier, the poor get poorer.

Your proposals just don't work. In the real world there are many kids already suffering from poverty. Again record levels in the UK. There are families out there choosing between heat or food. There are people paying 50% of their income on rent alone. And guess whose pockets are being lined with that money.

And let's not forget all the other scandal and corruption of these torys. Owning flats in London but renting them out for profit while getting free accommodation provided in London as an expense at our cost.

Spending 100s of thousands to decorate a flat and not declaring the money.

Buying up a load of luxury flats and not declaring the pruchaes and then claiming its just an "oversight".

Paying out 100k a year for life every other month to the newest tory pm not elected by the people.

Billions of pounds handed out to friends of torys with no ppe experience because there was no need to tendor and then blocking investigations into these dealings and not attempting to recover the funds.

Claiming non dom status while working as a mp to avoid tax. As well as the current pm wife also claiming non dom status to avoid tax.

Moving their companies to the cayman Islands to avoid paying corporation tax. JRM

And were simply just scratching the surface here with the scandal after scandal.

And you want working class people like me and others to believe that this Tory party who actively avoid tax through multiple loopholes along with the donors, are best served to get the country out of a financial mess which was largely stimulated by themselves last month.

Like really?

You suggest raising tax for the higher bracket. But will any of that be paid in tax? Of course it won't. Pay into ISAs. Pay into pensions. Donate to charities. All the same tricks used by higher earners will continue to be used to pay as little tax as possible.

The milks run dry. You can't milk the poorest any more. The hard decisions which need to be made are tackling the super wealthy.

People try to compare the radical changes Corbyn wanted to apply to a dystopian universe. A dystopia universe is having millions of people struggling to put food on their table while working 40 hour weeks, while boys like Bezos and Musk are worth near half a trillion between the pair of them.

I genuinely whole heartedly believe we're not far off a revolution happening in the UK in the coming years. And even the most naive of society are starting to see through the whole "it's those on benefits" "it's those damn immigrants" rhetoric. The real war is the class war. And it has real potential to get ugly without radical change.

 

[lefty_jakobz]

I don't know. And i don't even know what the legal bar is for an act to be classed as terrorism, that's why I asked.
What classifies an incident as terrorist?

If the assailant is non white its classed as terrorism.

 

[Mart1974]

So I think you could agree then that this Tory government isn't capable in the slightest of resolving the financial issues we're facing right now. The proof is in the pudding so to speak.

And then to add on top of that Brexit which has crippled the economy further and then Liz Truss blowing a big hole in the economy too.

And then the billions wasted on furtbough and ppe contracts.

And despite all this inequality continues to grow. The wealthy get wealthier, the poor get poorer.

Your proposals just don't work. In the real world there are many kids already suffering from poverty. Again record levels in the UK. There are families out there choosing between heat or food. There are people paying 50% of their income on rent alone. And guess whose pockets are being lined with that money.

And let's not forget all the other scandal and corruption of these torys. Owning flats in London but renting them out for profit while getting free accommodation provided in London as an expense at our cost.

Spending 100s of thousands to decorate a flat and not declaring the money.

Buying up a load of luxury flats and not declaring the pruchaes and then claiming its just an "oversight".

Paying out 100k a year for life every other month to the newest tory pm not elected by the people.

Billions of pounds handed out to friends of torys with no ppe experience because there was no need to tendor and then blocking investigations into these dealings and not attempting to recover the funds.

Claiming non dom status while working as a mp to avoid tax. As well as the current pm wife also claiming non dom status to avoid tax.

Moving their companies to the cayman Islands to avoid paying corporation tax. JRM

And were simply just scratching the surface here with the scandal after scandal.

And you want working class people like me and others to believe that this Tory party who actively avoid tax through multiple loopholes along with the donors, are best served to get the country out of a financial mess which was largely stimulated by themselves last month.

Like really?

You suggest raising tax for the higher bracket. But will any of that be paid in tax? Of course it won't. Pay into ISAs. Pay into pensions. Donate to charities. All the same tricks used by higher earners will continue to be used to pay as little tax as possible.

The milks run dry. You can't milk the poorest any more. The hard decisions which need to be made are tackling the super wealthy.

People try to compare the radical changes Corbyn wanted to apply to a dystopian universe. A dystopia universe is having millions of people struggling to put food on their table while working 40 hour weeks, while boys like Bezos and Musk are worth near half a trillion between the pair of them.

I genuinely whole heartedly believe we're not far off a revolution happening in the UK in the coming years. And even the most naive of society are starting to see through the whole "it's those on benefits" "it's those damn immigrants" rhetoric. The real war is the class war. And it has real potential to get ugly without radical change.

This is a great post. Summarises the situation perfectly.

 

[ThehatchetMan]

This is a great post. Summarises the situation perfectly.

Thank you mate and to think we're only scratching the surface too.

It bemuses me how the same old rhetoric comes out once again. "it's all down to labour in 03-08 they crashed the economy".

Well that why the feck did the majority of tory mps and tory members vote in a PM in the summer whose whole manifesto was around tax cuts (for the rich and the business owners). If all this is from 03-08 why did the majority of the party support and vote in someone who wanted to do the biggest tax cuts the country (well rich) have ever seen?

It's one of two things:

1. The economy was fecked before anyway. In which case, the tory party have proven they don't know what the feck they're doing to fix it as they all seen Lizs solution as the answer and voted her in, which in turn has made things much worse and amplfieid all the problems.

2. The economy wasn't actually as bad as some suggest before Liz stepped in. And it was her, and all her supporters, who crashed the economy. Which again shows the tories can't be trusted to fix the issue.

But of course here we are having exhausted the usual "it's immigrants that's the issue", "it's people on benefits that's the issue", "it's the tofu eating wokarati that's the issue" and we are back to the old classic "guys y'know none of this is our fault. It was actually labour who caused it 20 years ago. We're just cleaning up their mess". While of course doubling our debt at the same time while destroying our NHS over the last decade. That doesn't sound like a party which know how to fix it. To me it sounds like a party who have just made everything worse. Germany debt in the same period has went the opposite direction. So it shows it can be done, you just need the right leadership. Something we've not had for near 15 years.

The common denominator though is the Conservative party.. And do i trust one of the wealthiest men in the UK whose family avoids tax, who boasts about having no working class friends and celebrates changing algorithms to move money out of deprived areas to affluent tory areas. Do. I. feck.

Unfortunately the problems run even deeper than that and I'm not particularly a fan of Starmer either by any means. But that's for another day. He's a huge upgrade on any of the current lot anyway.

But a good starting point would be getting rid of this corrupt, self indulgent, narracastic group of venom and hopefully banish them all to the Isle of Mann to never be seen again.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

“If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face—for ever.”
― George Orwell

To be fair this does seem a lot like 1984. Specifically the bit where he actually reads a book in the book and it goes on for so long that you want to stamp your own face in for relief.

 

[Eendracht maakt macht]

I don't know. And i don't even know what the legal bar is for an act to be classed as terrorism, that's why I asked.
What classifies an incident as terrorist?

For the UK

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism_Act_2000#Definition_of_terrorism

 

[Mr Pigeon]

So I think you could agree then that this Tory government isn't capable in the slightest of resolving the financial issues we're facing right now. The proof is in the pudding so to speak.

And then to add on top of that Brexit which has crippled the economy further and then Liz Truss blowing a big hole in the economy too.

And then the billions wasted on furtbough and ppe contracts.

And despite all this inequality continues to grow. The wealthy get wealthier, the poor get poorer.

Your proposals just don't work. In the real world there are many kids already suffering from poverty. Again record levels in the UK. There are families out there choosing between heat or food. There are people paying 50% of their income on rent alone. And guess whose pockets are being lined with that money.

And let's not forget all the other scandal and corruption of these torys. Owning flats in London but renting them out for profit while getting free accommodation provided in London as an expense at our cost.

Spending 100s of thousands to decorate a flat and not declaring the money.

Buying up a load of luxury flats and not declaring the pruchaes and then claiming its just an "oversight".

Paying out 100k a year for life every other month to the newest tory pm not elected by the people.

Billions of pounds handed out to friends of torys with no ppe experience because there was no need to tendor and then blocking investigations into these dealings and not attempting to recover the funds.

Claiming non dom status while working as a mp to avoid tax. As well as the current pm wife also claiming non dom status to avoid tax.

Moving their companies to the cayman Islands to avoid paying corporation tax. JRM

And were simply just scratching the surface here with the scandal after scandal.

And you want working class people like me and others to believe that this Tory party who actively avoid tax through multiple loopholes along with the donors, are best served to get the country out of a financial mess which was largely stimulated by themselves last month.

Like really?

You suggest raising tax for the higher bracket. But will any of that be paid in tax? Of course it won't. Pay into ISAs. Pay into pensions. Donate to charities. All the same tricks used by higher earners will continue to be used to pay as little tax as possible.

The milks run dry. You can't milk the poorest any more. The hard decisions which need to be made are tackling the super wealthy.

People try to compare the radical changes Corbyn wanted to apply to a dystopian universe. A dystopia universe is having millions of people struggling to put food on their table while working 40 hour weeks, while boys like Bezos and Musk are worth near half a trillion between the pair of them.

I genuinely whole heartedly believe we're not far off a revolution happening in the UK in the coming years. And even the most naive of society are starting to see through the whole "it's those on benefits" "it's those damn immigrants" rhetoric. The real war is the class war. And it has real potential to get ugly without radical change.

I'm getting this post printed out and framed in my living room. The kids' photos can get moved to the bathroom.

 

[ThehatchetMan]

I'm getting this post printed out and framed in my living room. The kids' photos can get moved to the bathroom.

Mate I don't want your kids pictures on my car roof, the neighbours will start talking about me.

Should go without saying by the way, but no pedophile or incest jokes as I know what some of you can be like.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

Mate I don't want your kids pictures on my car roof, the neighbours will start talking about me.

Should go without saying by the way, but no pedophile or incest jokes as I know what some of you can be like.

I've got man-flu at the moment so it took me a minute to figure out what the feck you were talking about.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

So I think you could agree then that this Tory government isn't capable in the slightest of resolving the financial issues we're facing right now. The proof is in the pudding so to speak.

And then to add on top of that Brexit which has crippled the economy further and then Liz Truss blowing a big hole in the economy too.

And then the billions wasted on furtbough and ppe contracts.

And despite all this inequality continues to grow. The wealthy get wealthier, the poor get poorer.

Your proposals just don't work. In the real world there are many kids already suffering from poverty. Again record levels in the UK. There are families out there choosing between heat or food. There are people paying 50% of their income on rent alone. And guess whose pockets are being lined with that money.

And let's not forget all the other scandal and corruption of these torys. Owning flats in London but renting them out for profit while getting free accommodation provided in London as an expense at our cost.

Spending 100s of thousands to decorate a flat and not declaring the money.

Buying up a load of luxury flats and not declaring the pruchaes and then claiming its just an "oversight".

Paying out 100k a year for life every other month to the newest tory pm not elected by the people.

Billions of pounds handed out to friends of torys with no ppe experience because there was no need to tendor and then blocking investigations into these dealings and not attempting to recover the funds.

Claiming non dom status while working as a mp to avoid tax. As well as the current pm wife also claiming non dom status to avoid tax.

Moving their companies to the cayman Islands to avoid paying corporation tax. JRM

And were simply just scratching the surface here with the scandal after scandal.

And you want working class people like me and others to believe that this Tory party who actively avoid tax through multiple loopholes along with the donors, are best served to get the country out of a financial mess which was largely stimulated by themselves last month.

Like really?

You suggest raising tax for the higher bracket. But will any of that be paid in tax? Of course it won't. Pay into ISAs. Pay into pensions. Donate to charities. All the same tricks used by higher earners will continue to be used to pay as little tax as possible.

The milks run dry. You can't milk the poorest any more. The hard decisions which need to be made are tackling the super wealthy.

People try to compare the radical changes Corbyn wanted to apply to a dystopian universe. A dystopia universe is having millions of people struggling to put food on their table while working 40 hour weeks, while boys like Bezos and Musk are worth near half a trillion between the pair of them.

I genuinely whole heartedly believe we're not far off a revolution happening in the UK in the coming years. And even the most naive of society are starting to see through the whole "it's those on benefits" "it's those damn immigrants" rhetoric. The real war is the class war. And it has real potential to get ugly without radical change.

I think this is why they are passing through most draconian anti protest laws. They know what they are doing.

 

[RedfromIreland]

Hancock’s half hour.

 

[Buster15]

Hancock’s half hour.

Hope he gets voted to do all the shity trials.

 

[Mart1974]

Thank you mate and to think we're only scratching the surface too.

It bemuses me how the same old rhetoric comes out once again. "it's all down to labour in 03-08 they crashed the economy".

Well that why the feck did the majority of tory mps and tory members vote in a PM in the summer whose whole manifesto was around tax cuts (for the rich and the business owners). If all this is from 03-08 why did the majority of the party support and vote in someone who wanted to do the biggest tax cuts the country (well rich) have ever seen?

It's one of two things:

1. The economy was fecked before anyway. In which case, the tory party have proven they don't know what the feck they're doing to fix it as they all seen Lizs solution as the answer and voted her in, which in turn has made things much worse and amplfieid all the problems.

2. The economy wasn't actually as bad as some suggest before Liz stepped in. And it was her, and all her supporters, who crashed the economy. Which again shows the tories can't be trusted to fix the issue.

But of course here we are having exhausted the usual "it's immigrants that's the issue", "it's people on benefits that's the issue", "it's the tofu eating wokarati that's the issue" and we are back to the old classic "guys y'know none of this is our fault. It was actually labour who caused it 20 years ago. We're just cleaning up their mess". While of course doubling our debt at the same time while destroying our NHS over the last decade. That doesn't sound like a party which know how to fix it. To me it sounds like a party who have just made everything worse. Germany debt in the same period has went the opposite direction. So it shows it can be done, you just need the right leadership. Something we've not had for near 15 years.

The common denominator though is the Conservative party.. And do i trust one of the wealthiest men in the UK whose family avoids tax, who boasts about having no working class friends and celebrates changing algorithms to move money out of deprived areas to affluent tory areas. Do. I. feck.

Unfortunately the problems run even deeper than that and I'm not particularly a fan of Starmer either by any means. But that's for another day. He's a huge upgrade on any of the current lot anyway.

But a good starting point would be getting rid of this corrupt, self indulgent, narracastic group of venom and hopefully banish them all to the Isle of Mann to never be seen again.

Still mostly agree with you except I am not sure what the Isle of Mann has done to deserve this shower of bastards

 

[Mr Pigeon]

Still mostly agree with you except I am not sure what the Isle of Mann has done to deserve this shower of bastards

The last time we banished them to a British island it was Orkney but within a week they all got eaten by the locals.

 

[TheGame]

Why are idiots of the IEA allowed on programmes such as this:

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[TheGame]

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[Rams]

So I think you could agree then that this Tory government isn't capable in the slightest of resolving the financial issues we're facing right now. The proof is in the pudding so to speak.

And then to add on top of that Brexit which has crippled the economy further and then Liz Truss blowing a big hole in the economy too.

And then the billions wasted on furtbough and ppe contracts.

And despite all this inequality continues to grow. The wealthy get wealthier, the poor get poorer.

Your proposals just don't work. In the real world there are many kids already suffering from poverty. Again record levels in the UK. There are families out there choosing between heat or food. There are people paying 50% of their income on rent alone. And guess whose pockets are being lined with that money.

And let's not forget all the other scandal and corruption of these torys. Owning flats in London but renting them out for profit while getting free accommodation provided in London as an expense at our cost.

Spending 100s of thousands to decorate a flat and not declaring the money.

Buying up a load of luxury flats and not declaring the pruchaes and then claiming its just an "oversight".

Paying out 100k a year for life every other month to the newest tory pm not elected by the people.

Billions of pounds handed out to friends of torys with no ppe experience because there was no need to tendor and then blocking investigations into these dealings and not attempting to recover the funds.

Claiming non dom status while working as a mp to avoid tax. As well as the current pm wife also claiming non dom status to avoid tax.

Moving their companies to the cayman Islands to avoid paying corporation tax. JRM

And were simply just scratching the surface here with the scandal after scandal.

And you want working class people like me and others to believe that this Tory party who actively avoid tax through multiple loopholes along with the donors, are best served to get the country out of a financial mess which was largely stimulated by themselves last month.

Like really?

You suggest raising tax for the higher bracket. But will any of that be paid in tax? Of course it won't. Pay into ISAs. Pay into pensions. Donate to charities. All the same tricks used by higher earners will continue to be used to pay as little tax as possible.

The milks run dry. You can't milk the poorest any more. The hard decisions which need to be made are tackling the super wealthy.

People try to compare the radical changes Corbyn wanted to apply to a dystopian universe. A dystopia universe is having millions of people struggling to put food on their table while working 40 hour weeks, while boys like Bezos and Musk are worth near half a trillion between the pair of them.

I genuinely whole heartedly believe we're not far off a revolution happening in the UK in the coming years. And even the most naive of society are starting to see through the whole "it's those on benefits" "it's those damn immigrants" rhetoric. The real war is the class war. And it has real potential to get ugly without radical change.

I hate to point it out but the left politicians are just as corrupt as the right wing ones unfortunately. It’s not that I don’t agree with you in essence, it’s just that corruption happens all over the political landscape. Even after the communist revolution in Russia the corruption just moved from one to another and got even worse. Just saying like.