Shown more balls than Pereira atleast, fighting for his spot. Reckon we can keep him on as a squad player next season, and only loan him out the next if it doesn't work. I believe he won't go on loan, he will probably make it to atleast Lingard status here as a handy man on the bench.
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Pretty much everyone and quite rightly have been comparing him to to Fletcher lol. To be fair that style is remiscinent of Keane too...but well love your optimism. Kid has got good potential. He seems to have the basics but most of all, like Lingard, the fearlessness to play.
Great potential and some promising displays lately. Hopefully develops into a Keane or Fletcher esque player that most of us are hoping for.
The boy is tough and hard working, and the best part is whenever he is tackled he just does not roll around like a cry baby. But rather picks himself up and back to what he needs to execute on the pitch. Remember the commentators saying that he seems to be programmed by Mourinho to do a specific job, which he executes to near perfection.
The boy is tough and hard working, and the best part is whenever he is tackled he just does not roll around like a cry baby. But rather picks himself up and back to what he needs to execute on the pitch. Remember the commentators saying that he seems to be programmed by Mourinho to do a specific job, which he executes to near perfection.
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...ho-inside-story-midfield-tactic-a8230886.html
Good article on him. He played only 12 matches in three years for U18's.
However you rate him, it's difficult not to root for a story like him. Even for regular youth United watchers like me, it has come as a shock that he's playing for United and last year I'd have named atleast 15 youth players who IMO had a better chance of making it at United than him. He still hasn't made it yet ofcourse but the improvement has been incredible.
Good article on him. He played only 12 matches in three years for U18's.
However you rate him, it's difficult not to root for a story like him. Even for regular youth United watchers like me, it has come as a shock that he's playing for United and last year I'd have named atleast 15 youth players who IMO had a better chance of making it at United than him. He still hasn't made it yet ofcourse but the improvement has been incredible.
Honestly I see more potential in him than with young Fletcher and Butt.
I think Jose see's him as a like for like replacement for Fellaini - physical presence who follows instructions to the letter. Does not have the offensive threat of Fellaini, but he has not been asked to play that role yet
Might be time for you to try and find a new sport
Yes Scott looks good, but Darren fletcher was PFA team of the year, the MAN in midfield in a team reaching CL finals, and a huge big game player
SAF wanted to play Darren in the PL when he was still a schoolboy, but the FA blocked it - that should show you how highly rated he was. Sir Alex didn't try that with anyone else, not Giggs not Scholes not Beckham
The disrespect on Darren Fletcher's name on this forum is, frankly, an absolute disgrace. The man went through hell with his life changing illness and what thanks does he get - this shambolic underrating and slandering of his football ability by these awful comparisons.
SAF also thought that Wallwork was the next Steve Bruce and that Dong was the next Gabriel Batistuta. Back to the subject I think that Mctominay has what it takes to become better then Fletcher. Shouldn't I be entitled to an opinion without being dragged into sentimentalism and drama? I mean we're talking about Fletcher here, not some world class article like Scholes or Charlton.
Fletcher is still one of my all time United favorites, but you are rewriting history here. When he first broke into the team he was not anywhere near the player he became later and copped loads of flack, much more than McTominay. The statement by devilish refers to young Fletcher, and young Fletcher was not the MAN
Thanks and this. That's why I prefer to use one liners with certain people. Oh well.
Fair enough, everyone is entitled to your opinion I guess
Fletcher was verging on world class pre illness IMO, hence his PFA team of the year inclusion over Gerrard/Lampard/Scholes etc
"We're talking about Fletcher here" - yes the man who was a better player than Carrick in his prime, McTominay could become half the player fletcher was and I'd say he's a massive success story tbh
You're overrating how good Fletch was.
Sigh. Really?
Other people have said it, but Fletch was bang average when he first broke through, and was highly criticised for a few years.
Later on, his game evolved and he took it to the next level. Was a beast in the centre for us, absolutely.
How many of our academy players have been selected into the PFA Team of the year? He was a top, top player who was one of the first names on the team sheets for us during a time when we reached Champions League finals
He was immense during his short peak but let's not pretend that was his general level.
That is why I said young Fletcher and that's why we're talking about raw potential. If you asked back in the day whose got the biggest potential in Lingard's/Pogba's class then the answer would probably be Ravel Morrison. Hence one would be comfortable to say that Ravel had more potential then Lingard without having someone like your good self throwing him the history book at his face.
Regarding your last comment I am aware that during his last season Fletcher was flawless. However before that and after that he was nowhere near to Carrick let alone Scholes, Gerrard and Lampard.
The only reason that his peak was cut short was Ulcerative Colitis.
The fact that he's still been able to play in the PL for many years despite having his whole large bowel removed is testament to his ability.
He played something ridiculous like 90 PL games in a row after having an excision of his large bowel to treat Ulcerative colitis - he's managed to do that through bucketloads of natural ability
Even rival fans acknowledge this as a freakishly good achievement, yet our fans seem to forget this.
I would suggest that everyone reads up on Ulcerative colitis
He's our second top goalscorer after Lukaku. Lingard has been one of our best performers this season and that's definitely not just in a bench/handy man role. Achieving Lingard status is going to take a lot of work, there's not many of our players even close to it.
Since the 90s
Peter Beardsley (not 100% sure if he is classed as an academy product)
David Platt
Nicky Butt
Wes Brown
Gary Neville
Paul Scholes
Ryan Giggs
David Beckham
I didn't rate him alot back then. However, I wouldn't blame it solely on him tbh. SAF had the tendency of playing young players out of position in a bid to give them more first team experience and it wasn't unusual to see Fletcher on the right flank which certainly wasn't his position. I often wonder if the pros of that strategy (ie more first team experience) outweighed the cons of it. It certainly didn't helped Jones (RB and DM), Smalling (RB) and OShea (everywhere across the pitch) fullfill their full potential.
He was improving year on year, that game against Milan where he gave the cross for Rooney was sensational. I do think we never saw how good he would have been.
Huh? I’d say even McTominay is surprised at his level of inclusion this season. He plays a totally different role to pereira too. If anything pereira showed guts by heading off to yet another new situation to get games to show that he can either do it here or at another top club. Young players need loads of games to develop and hit their best form. Loans are the best way to do that
I remember Fletcher ready for his first game at 16. For the backroom staff at United, I’m quite sure the potential was more obvious with him than with McTominay. Butt was tipped as a new Robson by Harrison, while at 18 still being the most mature of the class of 92.
It’s tempting to assume McTom’s special talent as being not injured for almost two seasons at 17 and not being a bit too similar to Roy Keane.
Except for 18 months, he was pretty average all through out( before his health issues).
And no, he wasnt better than Carrick in his prime.
Mate Darren Fletcher was like 27 with that C.V.
How come? Mctominay was given the place after Pereira left. He wasn't a name in the first team yet.
I remember Fletcher's first game and privately saying 'Why the hype?' He was a jack of all trades ie solid and safe in what he did but nothing really special in anything. Butt gave me the impression of a bruiser, a poor's man Ince who would then ruin everything with a through ball that lead to nowhere. There again, these guys were surrounded by absolute class, Keane, Ince, Scholes, Carrick etc. Its difficult to impress when the bar is set that high (Scholes and Giggs did impress me but hey, we're talking of Scholes and Giggs here).
I see something in Mctominay that gives me hope that he's special. He's very mature for his age both physically and mentally. OT can be quite daunting for a young player so the temptation is to keep it very safe or go extreme to impress. Mctominay seem to avoid that trap altogether. He's got the skills, the characteristics and the attitude of a 26 year old whose been in the EPL for years.
I tend to be quite good in spotting good talent although I do have my fair share of failures on it (Adu and OShea).
Chelsea game showed the best and the worst of him imo. Completely took Hazard out of the game and was partially at fault for not tracking Willian for their goal. Obviously the latter will get better with time and maturity as he plays more. Looking forward to seeing him become a more integral part of the team. If Jose can start coaching him to play a few more forward passes at the right times, he'll become a real asset. That ball to Lukaku was a peach to turn possession instantly into attack.
Yes, Darren fletcher in his prime was better than Carrick. Thats why Sir Alex picked him over Carrick in certain big games. As great as carsick was, he was often found wanting in tough European games
Eg Bayern 2010 at home, fletcher held his own against schweinsteiger in his prime, whilst carrick wilted completely
I'm just not seeing it to be honest. Look, I'm chuffed that Jose is trusting a youth team product and giving him serious game-time but both he and some of our fans are massively over-stating how good Scott has been. If Scott was a Brazilian lad we'd signed for about £15m in the summer, we'd all simply be saying "he's doing alright, he may improve over time, still a bit raw etc". But as he's a youth team lad, some are acting like he's pulling up trees.
He strikes me as a hard-working but very limited footballers, a bit like Cleverly actually. I expect him, on current form, to have a similar career to Clev as well. He'll feature a lot as a squad player for a couple of seasons, do reasonably well, then will end up somewhere like West Ham.
That said, he has done exactly what's been asked of him and I'm happy he's around as we're short on numbers in midfield.
He strikes me as a hard-working but very limited footballers, a bit like Cleverly actually. I expect him, on current form, to have a similar career to Clev as well. He'll feature a lot as a squad player for a couple of seasons, do reasonably well, then will end up somewhere like West Ham.
That said, he has done exactly what's been asked of him and I'm happy he's around as we're short on numbers in midfield.
So you are sampling one game to prove your point. Not only fletchers prime lasted less than only 18 months but also Carrick was our main man for 5 titles and 1 CL - thats not even remotely comparable .
Scholes - Fletcher midfield wouldnt have won that much. SAF himself being a scot, helped a lot as well. Still remember the games we were completely frustrated with his contributions on the pitch.
See, Fletcher is a good player. United through and through . I don't want to downplay his contributions either but in reality he was just another player who got a nice ride because we never upgraded our midfield options for 5-7 years.
I remember seeing Fletchers first games for United thinking the same. This was in 2003 or something, three years after he was supposed to come on as a 16-year old schoolboy. Three years of injuries, broken leg and growth problems. So his talent was not represented fully at that time. The first couple of years was also marked by him being trained to be more muscular, losing a bit of speed in the step, and transitioning into central midfield. By the time he was ready, Carrick and Scholes had become one of the best central midfield combos around. So no wonder we didn’t see it, but Fergie and his crew surely had not seen wrong.
Interesting, looking at McTominay, to think Mourinho said this about Fletcher in 2009 before the CL final:
"Fletcher is more important than people think. His work in midfield, especially in the midfield 'wars', in crucial matches is very important. Man United will miss his pace and aggression in defensive actions: he 'eats' opponents in defensive transition. I believe Xavi and Andrés Iniesta are happy Fletch is not playing."[42]
Its very difficult to assess Fletcher to be honest. He was a decent talent but he was not a child prodigy like lets say Giggs and Ronaldo were. SAF did the mistake of hyping him a bit too early (did the same with Pogba and that backfired on him spectacularly) then went on messing a bit more by having him playing on his flank which was a bit embarrassing (no disrespect to Fletch but he's no winger). However kudos to the old man for insisting on him and kudos for Fletch for showing an attitude to par of the likes of Gaz. When we started benefiting from the results tragedy happened and everything wents tits up.
What I was referring to is that Mctominay seems so ready for first team something that Fletcher was not. Of course, Mctominay got introduced to first team football at a later stage to Fletch + he benefited greatly from that 6ft3 frame of his that makes it so easier for him. However while not being a child prodigy either, there's something in him that makes me feel very positive about him. Usually kids either play it very safe not to embarrass themselves or go overboard to impress. Mctominay seems already got that balance in him. Its weird but he looks like somebody had placed an experienced player brain in his young body. FFS sometimes I feel that he's more mature then Pogba and the Frenchman is way more experienced then he is. (I hope no one will suggest that I am saying Mctominay > Pogba its not the case)
Ultimately none of my posts were meant to disrespect Fletcher or Butt. In their prime both players would walk in our current first team at ease and if Mctominay can emulate their career's success then we will all be happy. However we're talking about raw talent here and somehow I feel this guy's 'package' MIGHT take him to very high places.
Probably about right, especially the part about following instructions, hence him starting over Pogba. In comparison to Fellaini, he seems more mobile, a bit better defensively, and has a better range of passing.
It'll be interesting to see his progression. If he comes close to Fletcher's top level, we should be happy.
Delighted more like it.
Disagree completely - Fletch was always a first pick in the big games
You could argue someone like Park benefitted from a lack of strengthening, but not fletcher
Because he was played out of position on the RW for years and fans who weren’t familiar with him were comparing him to Beckham! Whilst fergie rated him very highly he did him no favours playing him out of position. It would be like asking Keane to play RW
Only when he got consistent starts in the middle did we see the real b2b fletcher. Unfortunately injuries came along and stopped him reaching his very peak
So he'll either be a new Cleverley or a new Fletcher.
Or worse than both. Which is the most likely outcome.
I bet you he won't be that bad.
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