Jurgen Klopp Sack Watch

erikcred

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What is he right about exactly?
That refs are woefully inconsistent in their decision making. You seem to be shocked by this. You do know that there is one set of rules for Casemiro and another for Fabinho, Rodri etc.?
 

roonster09

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So you think they deliberately make poor decisions to fit narratives and have agendas that basically make them corrupt, instead of just, you know, making poor decisions because they're not that great.
Ofcourse refs try to influence the game by being inconsistent in their decision making. How many times have we seen them not giving second yellow for a player when the player makes blatant second yellow card offense.

It's not that they are corrupt, it's just that they don't want to be in the headlines for wrong reasons, so they take easy way out most times.

Also yes, they are not great and generally very inconsistent. That's why I said they should get plenty of criticism. I mean it's same for anyone, players, managers or any other coaches.
 

BusbyMalone

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Ofcourse refs try to influence the game by being inconsistent in their decision making. How many times have we seen them not giving second yellow for a player when the player makes blatant second yellow card offense.

It's not that they are corrupt, it's just that they don't want to be in the headlines for wrong reasons, so they take easy way out most times.

Also yes, they are not great and generally very inconsistent. That's why I said they should get plenty of criticism. I mean it's same for anyone, players, managers or any other coaches.
You wouldn't get any disagreements from me about refs making mistakes, as I think the standard of refereeing is very poor. I just don't like the insinuation that most refs are making these poor decisions deliberately to fit a narrative. They're just poor, inconsistent decisions.

And they absolutely deserve criticism, yeah.

Although saying they deserve no respect is a bit much. Again, this is not me saying that they shouldn't be criticized, but when you see this absolute weapon bounding down the touchline, jumping around like a fecking ape in front of officials, they don't deserve that shite either. I'm not saying you said they do deserve that treatment, but the complete lack of respect they get just encourages this behaviour.
 

roonster09

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You wouldn't get any disagreements from me about refs making mistakes, as I think the standard of refereeing is very poor. I just don't like the insinuation that most refs are making these poor decisions deliberately to fit a narrative. They're just poor, inconsistent decisions.

And they absolutely deserve criticism, yeah.

Although saying they deserve no respect is a bit much. Again, this is not me saying that they shouldn't be criticized, but when you see this absolute weapon bounding down the touchline, jumping around like a fecking ape in front of officials, they don't deserve that shite either. I'm not saying you said they do deserve that treatment, but the complete lack of respect they get just encourages this behaviour.
I agree about that ape, ref should have knocked that twat out. Pathetic behaviour.
 

erikcred

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He needs to scream in the 4th officials face about this after sprinting and pulling his hamstring like a fecking Ihni binni dimi diniwiny anitaime? You do that shit in the press conferences and interviews and official complaints. Wise up.
No, he doesn't need to do that. Maybe you should read the posts you reply to? Here, I've helped you by highlighting the bit that was difficult for you to read when you quoted it.

Wow, why so much aggression? He's absolutely right about the refs. And you're right about Klopp. He deserves at least 3-game touchline ban.
 

VeevaVee

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Glad the media are finally making a big deal out of it now.

He had the cheek to complain that they ‘won spectacularly’ and the only headlines are about him. Maybe don’t be such a dickhead it overshadows your team then?
 

sugar_kane

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I'm really glad this prick is making it easy to hate him nowadays.

His whole nice guy persona is as genuine as his top row of teeth.
 

Mr Pigeon

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So he regrets the headlines but not the acts themselves? Twat.
He's also not a resentful person and he tries not to say the things he says. We know all of this because he told us, therefore his actual actions aren't important...

He's a whining little twat with a temper shorter than his pitiful club's moment as the top team in the Premier League. I hope his next shite turns out to be a hedgehog.
 

Oscar Bonavena

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Hopefully he'll get a stadium ban for at least the remainder of the season. This Teutonic orangutan really needs to be brought to book, he's been allowed get away with murder for years.
 

bstb3

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He's been charged now link to bbc.

Hopefully they throw the book at him and it lands corner first. It's about time he was made an example of, rather than it just being brushed off as "ho ho, there goes old excitable Jurgen getting carried away on the Anfield air again". I really do hope they are consistent though, and do the same if other managers act up after it. Tribalism aside it needs to be one rule for all. Silva got a 2 match ban and hefty fine after being sent off at ours & Klopp managed to out do him here and in the conference afterwards, so...
 

Abraxas

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I had lot of sympathy for them pre-VAR as it's human nature to make mistakes when things happen at such high pace and players trying to con the ref at every given opportunity but with VAR and so many eyes on the incident, I have 0 sympathy.

When the refs are inconsistent with the similar incident then you have to assume they are either incompetent fecks or taking the easy way out on which decision to give and which decisions not to give. I mean Everton got penalty and Rashford didn't, Michael fecking Oliver was the ref in one game and was in charge of VAR for other, I dont know how they even explain such blatant nonsense. Casemiro got red card when his studs bounced off the ball and caught opponent ankle, so many studs to ankles barely gets yellow in other games and then you have Liverpool player planting his studs on opponent head and he didn't get red.

I'm not saying they should be abused, No one should receive abuse or threats but refs should get criticism and plenty of it for their shit decisions.
But possibly you are exaggerating what VAR used in its current format is capable of and that's why it's not reaching your standards, and you've run out of patience based on that. Fundamentally VAR can only increase good decision making, it can't ensure perfect decision making. Whether it has done that is something that requires looking at all the data, not just gut feeling or reference to specific examples of inconsistency that you mention. We are always going to have examples. Every club has hard luck stories.

The issue is football isn't cricket where sets of eyes on a replay near guarantees correctness. There is black, white and then grey in football. VAR is most impactful where it is black and white, i.e. offsides, and is still reliant on subjective opinion for the majority of match incidents. I don't see unanimous takes among astute observers of football on difficult decisions and yet they expect this degree of precision week to week from a referee or VAR. Maybe there should be a realisation within that about human observation of incidents and the inherent fallibility, one that doesn't require corruption, bias or bandwagon following to explain. Although clearly they are probably impacted by constant references to them in the media, because again... that's human fallibility.

But VAR aside, none of this should justify abuse from players and managers, it's really a separate issue and we need to separate fair criticism and creating a horrible environment for referees to perform under. As you mention, yes crap decisions should be called out at the right time and place and in the right manner. But it's not a case of "do your job well and you get respect." It's that a baseline level of decent treatment should include not being abused and threatened at work, and it says more to me about the character of those doing it than it tells me about the refs performance.
 

roonster09

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But possibly you are exaggerating what VAR used in its current format is capable of and that's why it's not reaching your standards, and you've run out of patience based on that. Fundamentally VAR can only increase good decision making, it can't ensure perfect decision making. Whether it has done that is something that requires looking at all the data, not just gut feeling or reference to specific examples of inconsistency that you mention. We are always going to have examples. Every club has hard luck stories.

The issue is football isn't cricket where sets of eyes on a replay near guarantees correctness. There is black, white and then grey in football. VAR is most impactful where it is black and white, i.e. offsides, and is still reliant on subjective opinion for the majority of match incidents. I don't see unanimous takes among astute observers of football on difficult decisions and yet they expect this degree of precision week to week from a referee or VAR. Maybe there should be a realisation within that about human observation of incidents and the inherent fallibility, one that doesn't require corruption, bias or bandwagon following to explain. Although clearly they are probably impacted by constant references to them in the media, because again... that's human fallibility.

But VAR aside, none of this should justify abuse from players and managers, it's really a separate issue and we need to separate fair criticism and creating a horrible environment for referees to perform under. As you mention, yes crap decisions should be called out at the right time and place and in the right manner. But it's not a case of "do your job well and you get respect." It's that a baseline level of decent treatment should include not being abused and threatened at work, and it says more to me about the character of those doing it than it tells me about the refs performance.
You made valid points but you are arguing that Refs are not robots, there is always a grey area and people make mistakes(based on how one interprets each action), on the other hand you expect players and managers to act like robots without showing any emotions. When you put so much effort to prepare and execute your plan, and you feel refs is screwing you, it's natural that people lose their shit.

I don't think refs are threatened on field, i don't think they are even abused by players as that results in yellow or even red card.

Nothing justifies that twat klopp acting like a lunatic but refs have done so much shit without ever being held responsible for their actions. Just like any other role, expectations and standards should be high for refs.
 

Winrar

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Odious wretch who hides behind "passion" to abuse referees.

What's more puzzling is Liverpool got away with so much during that game yet Klopp wasn't happy.
 

edcunited1878

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He's a muppet. Just a couple weeks ago was the assistant ref and hardman Robertson trying to get into the official's face and he feigned like he got punched in the face.

Now this episode. It's all allowed because this ass clown continues to do it and intimidate, bully, and confront officials in negative ways. Then he opens his gobshite mouth and tries to avoid his actions like they are nothing.
 

lex talionis

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We all understand managers losing their shit, but Klopp went so far beyond the line with his abusive gesture toward the fourth official when there was no dodgy referee decision to respond to that even the British media, who wank themselves until their eyes roll to the back of their head at everything Liverpool do (even took their side when Suarez racially abused Evra, at least initially) finally came to their senses that his behavior was intolerable and deserves punishment.
 

Anustart89

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So he was charged for his words rather than his actions?
Yes, so basically it's fair game to celebrate a goal by seeking out and screaming in the fourth official's face, as long as you don't imply that the main ref's dodgy afterwards.
 

roonster09

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It’s about time you pointed that out. Salah just deals with even though he constantly fouled with no whistles. Good observation by you and credit where it’s due.
The player who looked past it and struggled to beat defender was 56th in fouls won? Wow what. Surprising stat.

Shamelessly that twat somehow made it into conspiracy theory and as usual sheep will lap it up.
 

ti vu

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And Klopp's excuse to go ape shit about Salah getting fouled was the incident that Salah drew blood on Ben Davies...
 

Scroto Baggins

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Lucky to get a draw vs Spurs. How Jota stayed on the pitch I will never know, that is a red all day for me. High boot, studs showing, solid contact with Skipp's head, no attempt to pull out of the challenge.

i appreciate there was probably no intent, but it's straight up reckless and dangerous play.

Lucky the injury was not a lot more serious.
 

Dumbstar

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Lucky to get a draw vs Spurs. How Jota stayed on the pitch I will never know, that is a red all day for me. High boot, studs showing, solid contact with Skipp's head, no attempt to pull out of the challenge.

i appreciate there was probably no intent, but it's straight up reckless and dangerous play.

Lucky the injury was not a lot more serious.
I can bet not many sensible posters read much of your understanding of the game that you obviously watched very closely. :lol:
 

rimaldo

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I can bet not many sensible posters read much of your understanding of the game that you obviously watched very closely. :lol:
he’s an avid follower of the standings adjusted for referring and fa bias. if we take football as starting in 1992 and extrapolate the results since then and adjust the league structure accordingly, liverpool are currently battling for 6th place with the mighty isleworth gas workers 2nd 11 in the 42nd tier of regional football. united, however have transcended this dimension and are currently slapping a vishnu invitational 11.
 

Dumbstar

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Perhaps you could translate this into a coherent sentence.
He's saying they didn't draw against Spurs, with some poorly executed sarcasm.
Indeed I was, thanks. I try not to dumb down comprehension on Redcafe as I just expect people to follow the thread of the conversation rather than jumping in.
 

Scroto Baggins

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I can bet not many sensible posters read much of your understanding of the game that you obviously watched very closely. :lol:
The payer who ended up scoring the winner should not have even been on the pitch. Id put that in the lucky category for Klopp. Pretty simple eh.
 

Someone

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Worst thing about this for him is that he's been exposed as a liar. Reflects on him way more badly than the ref abuse imo. Will lose a lot of respect for this.
 

Andycoleno9

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He is becoming better in mind games than Fergie. This was masterpiece; rant on refs after they gifted you a win, escape a ban (how the feck he managed that?) and refs give you another dodgy penalty.
 

Oscar Bonavena

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Some Reddit twat has compiled a dossier on Tierney's "outrageous" decisions...

Only Klopp and Liverpool fans could complain about a referee who witnessed one of their players karate kid an opponent in the head right in front of him, still not send him off, and that player go on to score the winner.

Gaslighting on an industrial scale.