Not sure what your point is? I'm saying let's not judge players purely based on international football.
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My point is that Kane has been great in the PL, Rooney hasn't been great for years. People do not base their evaluation of Rooney only on last night but on his performances over the last 4 years.
Fergie did alot wrong in his last few years, But his evaluation of Rooney before he left was spot on. Unfortunately he was the only one with the balls to get shot of Rooney, The rest won't.
Rooneys bar is higher than Kane's. You can't compare them. Not saying he's been great but he's still better than 90% of English players in this country. Conversely you could argue that Kane should have been better as he was the form player where Rooney wasn't.
Age or tournament experience....Wales and Iceland players?
This, people have such low standards nowadays, that his useless ball retention, slow speed in thought, and the cross passes to the right are seen as playing well, that's beyond me.
Not sure what you talking about. It is obvious that any team would rather have Kane than Rooney. Rooney being better than most English players means feck all. This is United. Being better than most English players is not enough to be good for United.
Considering that there's an estimation of 8 million English men playing football in England then your statement sounds just about right. Close call though.
As for Rooney's bar being higher than Kane's, that surely must be a joke. Despite being perhaps England's worst player this tournament, Kane has had two great seasons at club level. Rooney been abysmal for most part of six years now.
Well that's just plain bollocks
Was beginning to wonder when the Rooney we all know and love was going to reappear.
We haven't had one full season of an in form Rooney in four years.......Hardly one game, it just makes a change that I can find it funny because its England and not united that suffer.
Rooney can only play one position for Utd and that is as a number 10. He cannot play as a striker as the little pace he had has gone. Also I would prefer Martial, Ibra and Rashford all ahead of him there. He cannot play in a midfield 2 as he is far too slow on the ball, and when pressed his ball retention goes. I would prefer to have Schneiderlin, Schwensteiger, Herrera, Blind and Forsu Mensah all there instead of him. With that being said
Schneiderlin/CM
Mkhitarian Rooney Martial
Ibra
or
Schneiderlin/CM
RW Mkhitarian Martial
Ibra
I prefer the second option. Ibra likes to drop deeper and would end up taking the space that Rooney occupies. Neither of them have any pace. I would like to see us sign a pacy direct right winger like Sane
Schneiderlin/CM
Mkhitarian Rooney Martial
Ibra
or
Schneiderlin/CM
RW Mkhitarian Martial
Ibra
I prefer the second option. Ibra likes to drop deeper and would end up taking the space that Rooney occupies. Neither of them have any pace. I would like to see us sign a pacy direct right winger like Sane
Lets call a spade a spade here, he isn't a good player anymore and certainly cannot be relied upon.
Yet the Rooney can still play number 10 myth endures...
28 Premier League apperances last season 8 goals and 6 assists. His stats resemble where his position currently is. Not quite a striker, not quite a creator. If the last 3 years of suffering with Moyes and Van Gaal has taught me is the time for sentiment is over. We need to be back challenging and winning the league. We stand a better chance to do that without him.
I get your point but you're on a United forum... do you really think the people here are judging Rooney based on a couple of games for England @Wilson Litchmore
Yeah people criticising Rooney are doing so off one bad game, and actually it was appalling rather than just bad, for England.
Not the at least 4 seasons now of increasingly shit performances for Utd.
Not the at least 4 seasons now of increasingly shit performances for Utd.
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He played the vast majority of games up front.
He only moved into midfield towards the end of the season.
Spare us the crap. It's not as if he's been putting in consistent top level performances. On the contrary, he's been subpar for the majority of the last 3 seasons now, and that's putting it nicely. You're surprised the knives come out after one game?
Surley hes going to lose the captaincy. Probably should follow Messi lead and retire as well from the international team
The worst part is Rooney still thinks he can play for a couple of more years but his performance suggest otherwise. I think He should be sold.
Not really, the whole team has been shuffled around in order to fit him in, and when it really counts he vanishes. Playing 3 in midfield against a team that are going to park the bus to accommodate such a hot and cold player as Rooney is madness. He should be on the bench, coming on as an impact player for both England and United.
It's myopic to look at Rooney's performances in isolation, of course he looks good occasionally, the whole team is geared around him even though it disrupts the natural game of the players that surround him. Alli is a notable example in my mind of someone who's looked poorer playing alongside Rooney. He's essentially Gerrard Mk 2, a headless chicken whose inclusion stops England looking like a much more cohesive team.
It's only three months ago since England beat Germany, admittedly it was a friendly, but if I was English I'd have much preferred to have seen Vardy and Kane both playing over three in midfield in this tournament. England shouldn't be messing around trying to play Spanish football, they have youthful, pacey players and an abundance of strikers. As a neutral it really annoys me, because there's potentially a really entertaining team there.
Three in midfield against teams that park the bus and high possession with a low amount of chances, sounds just like United, guess who the common link is!
The Rooney Defence Force are struggling with this one.
Majority of us here keep saying that Rooney is done as top player for years now. But how come the media in UK still think that he is still good. I couldn't think one but only Stan Collymore who actually did said that Rooney was done. Others than him keep repeating the same shit. New Scholes my arse.
Orwell, 1984.The media are creating a parallel world in which Rooney is still a top player.
Rooney finished the season well for us and IMO was having a decent tournament up until that 2nd half yesterday. He then reached the lowest level I have ever seen him reach - and that includes Villa away last year. Roy should have taken him off at 60 mins.
Saying all of that, I think he still has a role to play at United. I think Jose will like him at No.10 given how he likes his No.10s to put in a good defensive shift as well as chip in with goals. He's just not fit enough to play every week and I am sure we will see him rotated in CM/No.10/St next season. We hardly have loads of options in those positions so I do not want him sold.
Saying all of that, I think he still has a role to play at United. I think Jose will like him at No.10 given how he likes his No.10s to put in a good defensive shift as well as chip in with goals. He's just not fit enough to play every week and I am sure we will see him rotated in CM/No.10/St next season. We hardly have loads of options in those positions so I do not want him sold.
There are preparing, monitoring, considering excuses ala Woodward.
At some point last season I think when he made his 500th appearance for us United put a graph of how many goals he scored per 50 games in that time and it was really obvious when he peaked and that he was on the decline.
He was pretty average already vs Slovakia, played 40 min. there. He was poor already in the fist half vs Iceland. I shudder to think about Rooney as our No 10 next season. It would be less detrimental to United to use him as a FB.
But the 3 in midfield contain Rooney and Ali, so its really 2 attacking mids and a DM. Thats not a good enough excuse for these guys to mess up.
But I agree with you in general.
Hasn't been crap for six years. However, he has been getting slightly worse as a player every year since 2010.
Ferguson knew what was around the corner.
Rooney's bar is higher than Kane's in the same way that Maradona's is higher than Rooney's.
Rooney is finished at this level. He should have left with Fergie.
He needs to stop wearing a compression top/boddice every fecking game, it's summer for christ's sake. I can't remember the last time we saw his arms.
It is inconceivable that Rooney has one of those clauses that stipulates that he must play a certain percentage of games when fit?
Yes, it is inconceivable because there is no benefit for the club and United isn't managed by idiots.
If Mourinho refuses to drop him when he's inevitably shite, then it will start to look like it.
You say that but there are quite a few players with contracts like that albeit more common in La Liga.
I wouldn't be so sure
I have always defended Wayne even over the last 2 seasons, i always felt he deserved the extra chances for what he has done at the club and for how long he's been here and have no shame saying he's been one of my favorite United players. But the penny has finally dropped for me, its come to a point where hardcore Rooney fans are defending the indefensible.
He's clearly lost a lot of his physical ability which he relied a lot on and doesn't have the nouse to play in midfield. Yes we will get the odd moment/games where he shows some brilliance (e.g FA cup final) but it's clear he's finished as a top level footballer.
I don't mind him staying at the club but not as a starter. I have a feeling Mourinho will start him for a few months but his decline will be clear and eventually drops him. This could also mean this is Rooney's last season here as i can't see him being happy as a squad player.
He's clearly lost a lot of his physical ability which he relied a lot on and doesn't have the nouse to play in midfield. Yes we will get the odd moment/games where he shows some brilliance (e.g FA cup final) but it's clear he's finished as a top level footballer.
I don't mind him staying at the club but not as a starter. I have a feeling Mourinho will start him for a few months but his decline will be clear and eventually drops him. This could also mean this is Rooney's last season here as i can't see him being happy as a squad player.
Bebe.........£7 million.........Nuff said.
For me this is the key. His defenders and fanboys will always point to individual or a handful of games where he played well. Most recently, it's been "Oh but he's played well in the group stages" and "He played well in the closing stages of the season and in the FA Cup final". Even then, he was by no means stand out against Wales nor was he top level against Slovakia. Also, he performed during the last 2-3 games of the season when there was nothing to play for. The standard for "Good" when used to judge Rooney is really actually "decent / average / normal" for any other footballer. If you had him put on another name and face, there is no way in hell his fanboys would be calling his performances good.
On the other hand, his critics can easily point to vast stretches of games over the last 3-4 seasons where he's been undeniably shit. We don't need a player who is praised for performing in a handful of games but serves up pub level performances for the rest of it.
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