Westminster Politics

Mart1974

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it’s people wanting excuses to vote conservative or being unable to do anything other than be influenced by the media. happens every election. there’s a reason they keep getting in, because people keep voting for them, even if they say they won’t.
True enough.
 

Kaos

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Labour have been pretty inconsistent with their views on Israel. My local MP Kerry McCarthy has been asking for a peace deal from day one and is still the shadow secretary for climate change. I guess she just hasn't caused a headline on Twitter yet, but that's hardly a reasoning for the party to clamp down on the party line sometimes, but not always.
But the moment she dares to mention the 'G' word (despite the increasing evidence of the reality reflecting that), she'll get the boot.

They've been pretty consistent to appease the Rachel Rileys of the country and nothing more. All we're seeing now is some mild backtracking on the back of some internal polling panic that suggests they'll lose a substantial number of votes on the back of this issue. If or when they get into power, it'll be the usual pandering to the right wing media and purging dissenting voices.
 

Balljy

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But the moment she dares to mention the 'G' word (despite the increasing evidence of the reality reflecting that), she'll get the boot.

They've been pretty consistent to appease the Rachel Rileys of the country and nothing more. All we're seeing now is some mild backtracking on the back of some internal polling panic that suggests they'll lose a substantial number of votes on the back of this issue. If or when they get into power, it'll be the usual pandering to the right wing media and purging dissenting voices.
Yeah, that's a definite if she brought up genocide she would be out. I checked her Twitter after posting that, and I noticed that she had been quiet on the platform about Israel for a while now, although she has brought up a peace deal in parliament a few times into this year.

Agreed that it looks like they're going to flip to another policy again as the old one isn't working. It makes me wonder what these MP's say about Starmer behind the scenes as I know my one is pretty outspoken about Gaza locally.
 

Dumbstar

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If Labour condemns Israel, the right wing media and the Tories would be queuing up to bang the anti sematic drum. Rachel Riley would be writing attack tweets all day every day. Labour can do that if it is power but whilst trying to win an election? No chance.

My wife is a Muslim and she gets it, I find it difficult to believe that Muslims in the UK are going to let the Tories win the next election over an opposition party not condemning Israel, which would have no impact on Israel as Labour is not in power and has no power to do anything at this point.
Mart, appreciate what you're saying and I get it that you're trying to understand things from a different perspective.

But one thing British Muslims don't need is to be White-splained what they're/we're going through. (I realise I'm racistly guessing you are white but it's nothing to do with your race personally).

Your wife's opinions are hers alone.
 

Sweet Square

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Yep and Starmer is just basically another Cameron and Johnson empty vessel who has no personal values, just sails along with the prevailing winds of the overwhelmingly right wing press, just in the other side's colours. It's more depressing when you post those old clips of him, which put together made it look like there was potentially a decent leader in there once.
I can see why people voted for him in the leadership race as he did run the best campaign. I just don’t understand why the likes of Cameron, Johnson and Starmer do this job. Spending so much of their life activity trying to change nothing. Wouldn’t they be happier in a private sector job without all the attention. It’s very strange to me.

At least with Thatcher or Corbyn they wanted to change the country so all the misery they went through was for something bigger.

The day he gets elected his priority becomes re-election. He won't think he can do that by suddenly changing his opinions back to the lies that got him the leadership, he'll absolutely double down.

At least the bankers will be okay.

Yep agree with you. The right wing shift will only get worse when they get power.
 

Pexbo

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I can see why people voted for him in the leadership race as he did run the best campaign. I just don’t understand why the likes of Cameron, Johnson and Starmer do this job. Spending so much of their life activity trying to change nothing. Wouldn’t they be happier in a private sector job without all the attention. It’s very strange to me.

At least with Thatcher or Corbyn they wanted to change the country so all the misery they went through was for something bigger.


Yep agree with you. The right wing shift will only get worse when they get power.
Have you seen Johnson and Cameron’s bank balances since leaving office?
 

Mart1974

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Mart, appreciate what you're saying and I get it that you're trying to understand things from a different perspective.

But one thing British Muslims don't need is to be White-splained what they're/we're going through. (I realise I'm racistly guessing you are white but it's nothing to do with your race personally).

Your wife's opinions are hers alone.
Jesus. What has colour got to do with Islam? This is a ridiculous response.
 

RedSky

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If Labour condemns Israel, the right wing media and the Tories would be queuing up to bang the anti sematic drum. Rachel Riley would be writing attack tweets all day every day. Labour can do that if it is power but whilst trying to win an election? No chance.

My wife is a Muslim and she gets it, I find it difficult to believe that Muslims in the UK are going to let the Tories win the next election over an opposition party not condemning Israel, which would have no impact on Israel as Labour is not in power and has no power to do anything at this point.
The problem is that people are selfish morons who only care about their own self interests. Yes, you will have people like your wife who are compassionate about other people, but you will also get people who couldn't give a feck and just care about their bank balance. That doesn't mean an entire community will vote one way or another, everyone will have their own reasoning. Some will most certainly take what's happening in Gaza into account, other's won't give a damn. That's just how life and society are in the World right now.
 

Paul the Wolf

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If Labour do get elected, on which day will they announce , "actually we're only kidding, we're not the New Conservatives." The following day the Daily Mail hails them and forgets how much they hate Labour." Sounds plausible - not.

Instead of Labour offering nothing, why not get a leader who does offer some sort of hope? No - too scary, right wing press will stop him getting elected.

This makes no sense.
 

Mart1974

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The problem is that people are selfish morons who only care about their own self interests. Yes, you will have people like your wife who are compassionate about other people, but you will also get people who couldn't give a feck and just care about their bank balance. That doesn't mean an entire community will vote one way or another, everyone will have their own reasoning. Some will most certainly take what's happening in Gaza into account, other's won't give a damn. That's just how life and society are in the World right now.
I think I am making the same point. I am sure many people will be rightfully upset about Gaza and that will be across communities, viewpoints and creeds. I am not sure that it will be the single issue that will make people abstain or vote for a specific party though and if it means voting against a party who can currently do nothing about the Gaz situation then it is a ridiculous hill to die on
 

Mart1974

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If Labour do get elected, on which day will they announce , "actually we're only kidding, we're not the New Conservatives." The following day the Daily Mail hails them and forgets how much they hate Labour." Sounds plausible - not.

Instead of Labour offering nothing, why not get a leader who does offer some sort of hope? No - too scary, right wing press will stop him getting elected.

This makes no sense.
Look at PMQs today. Every attach response from Sunak was on the 28 billion green pledge, all the right wing press are running with it in a client journalism co-ordinated attack. Starmer has to be incredibly cautious about any position he takes
 

Paul the Wolf

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Look at PMQs today. Every attach response from Sunak was on the 28 billion green pledge, all the right wing press are running with it in a client journalism co-ordinated attack. Starmer has to be incredibly cautious about any position he takes
But if he's cautious today then when does the caution stop. That's what I mean. If he changes tack on whatever subject then he's going to get slaughtered by the right wing press. If he does nothing whatosever he'll get slaughtered by the right wing press. If he does anything he'll get slaughtered by the right wing press.

Having someone in power who offers nothing other than "not being the Tories" is pointless. Labour will be out of power in 2029 for another 10/15 years and the whole cycle will repeat.
The Tories have never been in such a weak position in recent times and the opportunity should be seized by someone who has got the guts to make serious changes. But everyone knows that won't happen with Starmer.
 

Fully Fledged

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Why doesn't Starmer tell him that an Interest Only Mortgage, doesn't pay your mortgage off, it only gives free money to your mortgage provider. I know that it can be used short term to help you if you are up shite creak but it's not the great answer that the Tories seem to think it is.
 

Giggsyking

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She's struggling to think what to say and keep up. The word market is a bit disastrous. Labour should note to keep her away from the media, rather like some footballers who should be instructed they are not allowed to shoot.
She is the Fred of the Labour party.
 

Sweet Square

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Have you seen Johnson and Cameron’s bank balances since leaving office?
True. It’s just they could have easily earned similar amounts of money and done similar amounts of coke working in the private sector.

It seems the likes of Starmer, Boris and Cameron get some sick thrill out of torturing both themselves and us.
 

Pexbo

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True. It’s just they could have easily earned similar amounts of money and done similar amounts of coke working in the private sector.

It seems the likes of Starmer, Boris and Cameron get some sick thrill out of torturing both themselves and us.
I’m not convinced they could, the profile it earns them and the connections and influence they built globally is lucrative. Johnson has earned nearly £5m from the speaking circuit alone since leaving office 18 months ago. Previous to being PM he was apparently in debt. Then you have all the kick backs outside of the official fees.
 

Sweet Square

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I’m not convinced they could, the profile it earns them and the connections and influence they built globally is lucrative. Johnson has earned nearly £5m from the speaking circuit alone since leaving office 18 months ago. Previous to being PM he was apparently in debt. Then you have all the kick backs outside of the official fees.
Ah cheers. Your right and tbh I had no idea Boris was in debut before.
 

decorativeed

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No surprise. I started saving for the first time in my life last year at the age of 43. Still probably a better idea to overpay the mortgage instead, but having been made redundant in the last few years, I need a safety net. So far I've saved about enough to keep me going for a month. So still screwed, potentially!
 

4bars

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True. It’s just they could have easily earned similar amounts of money and done similar amounts of coke working in the private sector.

It seems the likes of Starmer, Boris and Cameron get some sick thrill out of torturing both themselves and us.
No they would not. Johnson would not be hired by any relevant position in the private sector even with his background. At best middle management. Being a politician opens you the doors through favours given during their tenure. They put them in a high paid position as *insert whatever name* doing jack all besides meeting other people based on the influence that they still have in the party.
 

Sweet Square

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No surprise. I started saving for the first time in my life last year at the age of 43. Still probably a better idea to overpay the mortgage instead, but having been made redundant in the last few years, I need a safety net. So far I've saved about enough to keep me going for a month. So still screwed, potentially!
Yep. All it takes is another crash and so many of us are fecked.

Such a shite economy.
No they would not. Johnson would not be hired by any relevant position in the private sector even with his background. At best middle management. Being a politician opens you the doors through favours given during their tenure. They put them in a high paid position as *insert whatever name* doing jack all besides meeting other people based on the influence that they still have in the party.
He started as a writer for The Telegraph and then went on to become the editor of The Spectator. There’s plenty of well paying and useless jobs in the private sector.
 

4bars

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Yep. All it takes is another crash and so many of us are fecked.

Such a shite economy.

He started as a writer for The Telegraph and then went on to become the editor of The Spectator. There’s plenty of well paying and useless jobs in the private sector.
Doubt that he did more than 80k-100k a year that would keep doing for the rest of his life. Sure is a great salary but just to have a comfortable normal life and nothing compared with the amounts that he is making. The choice being a writter of politics is easy. Specially he probably worked more before than now
 

Frosty

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Doubt that he did more than 80k-100k a year that would keep doing for the rest of his life. Sure is a great salary but just to have a comfortable normal life and nothing compared with the amounts that he is making. The choice being a writter of politics is easy. Specially he probably worked more before than now
He would have more money if he had a vasectomy.