[chb23]

Against Palace? I expect he will, and he should. In the 10 role where he is allowed to lose the ball he shines. Against Palace he will have a lot of space and little pressure.

Its the basics he is doing wrong. Makes the wrong passes, runs into dead ends, holds ball too long. I have a feeling he is only playing because he can dribble with ball(albeit not well ATM) and has some pace

 

[BigCaine]

Lol. Lots of teams wish to have a liability like him. The team played shit and I dont have an explanation. But saying "hey Mkhi it was your fault" is wrong. It was a boring physical game. We just gave the ball away in the second half. I dont even wanna talk about all the players who were shit in the game. We won a bad played game, let move on. Im pretty sure the coach will figure it out. Whatever you say here wont change shit. 2/3rds on this forum have never even kicked a real ball here in their life and yet talk like they are pros.

So you are on a football forum created by fans for fellow fans and telling us that we shouldn't criticize or for that matter even chat about football because we don't know anything about it and the fact that posting anything amounts to nothing here as Mourinho does not care and it won't change anything.

Thanks for your contribution Mr. Pele/ Maradona/ Backenbauer who ever football great you are, though I am confused a bit though, if our criticism changes nothing why is it bothering your esteemed self so much. And if this humble peasant's may be heard, may be you too need to stop talking about it, since you have clearly opined that posting here doesn't matter, why waste your grace's precious time among uncouth never kicked a ball in our life rabbble like us.

 

[mattunited1978]

Infuriating player,when he's bad he's awful and when he's good he's still not great over 90 mins but has moments of quality. Think we'd be better off with martial and rashford either side of mata.

 

[Jerch]

I still don't get the criticism for him. He is in the team to provide that special moments and he is doing that in almost every game. He had good moments yesterday also but our players didn't capitalized on them. Problem yesterday wasn't Mkhitaryan but Matic and Fellaini not closing little pockets around our box.

 

[NoLogo]

He is a good player but certainly not a great one. After we got some quality FBs we need to look into getting a top quality attacking midfielder in.

 

[kouroux]

Dortmund.

It's in the past and it's time we forgot about it. What he did for Dortmund is meaningless to us.

 

[BigCaine]

I still don't get the criticism for him. He is in the team to provide that special moments and he is doing that in almost every game. He had good moments yesterday also but our players didn't capitalized on them. Problem yesterday wasn't Mkhitaryan but Matic and Fellaini not closing little pockets around our box.

Don't disagree that he had some good moments but his decision making was poor, he had multiple chances to put someone through on goal but chose the wrong option time and again.

His penchant for trying to make Hollywood plays rather than taking the smarter option has seen us loose the ball far too many times. If you look at his performances as a whole rather than just the one moment it works out as a goal he leaves a lot to be desired.

I know that goals win games and fact is he has a great number of assists and has contributed with goals that's what Zlatan gave us last season, but no one can disagree that overall improvement that Lukaku's play has brought to our team, something Zlatan for all his goals couldn't bring. I think we are in a similar boat with mkhi. Until he keeps his churning up assists and goals people will ignore his performances but the minute productivity goes down his faults become a lot more obvious as they did yesterday.

 

[Pexbo]

This place is so fecking bipolar. He was in stellar form in the first few matches and everyone was frothing over him. That dips for a couple of games and all of a sudden he’s flakey and should be dropped.

With his style of play, it’s inevitable that his bad days are going to stand out because his game is about taking risks and trying to force things to happen and not a lot else. He’s an enigma and a catalyst. You have to take the rough with the smooth because over the course of the season he will net double figures in goals and double figures in assists and that’s worth putting up with.

 

[Di Maria's angel]

Eerily similar to di Maria in his first season. Racking up the numbers with poor performances.

I wouldn't complain too much. He's been vital in our start that has seen us match everyone's wet dream team.

 

[Di Maria's angel]

This place is so fecking bipolar. He was in stellar form in the first few matches and everyone was frothing over him. That dips for a couple of games and all of a sudden he’s flakey and should be dropped.

With his style of play, it’s inevitable that his bad days are going to stand out because his game is about taking risks and trying to force things to happen and not a lot else. He’s an enigma and a catalyst. You have to take the rough with the smooth because over the course of the season he will net double figures in goals and double figures in assists and that’s worth putting up with.

The bitching is so fecking annoying. We've scored 17 goals in 6 games and people are still vigorously whining about one of our main contributors.

You'd think our fans, of all, would be extremely happy with what we've witnessed in the first few weeks of the season. We've been dog (fecking) shit for 3/4 years...

 

[Kapardin]

He's had one match when he didn't score or assist. So not crucifying him for it. Don't deny that he polarizes opinions like Ozil.

I expect atleast 10 league goals and 10+ assists from him this season regardless of whether he drifts in and out of games. If he gets that, no complaints.

 

[MThomas]

This place is so fecking bipolar. He was in stellar form in the first few matches and everyone was frothing over him. That dips for a couple of games and all of a sudden he’s flakey and should be dropped.

With his style of play, it’s inevitable that his bad days are going to stand out because his game is about taking risks and trying to force things to happen and not a lot else. He’s an enigma and a catalyst. You have to take the rough with the smooth because over the course of the season he will net double figures in goals and double figures in assists and that’s worth putting up with.

Meh, even in the start of the season he had very off / on performance, usually a horrible first half and a very good second half.

For me it's still a Saha / Ruud debate, as a single player he's racking up impressive numbers, but i think the team as a whole would be better off if we had someone there with more composure.

We'll see how he plays against Crystal Palace

 

[Pexbo]

Meh, even in the start of the season he had very off / on performance, usually a horrible first half and a very good second half.

For me it's still a Saha / Ruud debate, as a single player he's racking up impressive numbers, but i think the team as a whole would be better off if we had someone there with more composure.

We'll see how he plays against Crystal Palace

He’s literally been central to 75%+ of our best play. I’d like to hear how you invisage our better play without him.

 

[AgentP]

He’s literally been central to 75%+ of our best play. I’d like to hear how you invisage our better play without him.

Totally. He is instrumental to our fluid football. With Pogba being out, he becomes even more important as none of our other players can beat a man in the middle of the park.

 

[izec]

The bitching is so fecking annoying. We've scored 17 goals in 6 games and people are still vigorously whining about one of our main contributors.

You'd think our fans, of all, would be extremely happy with what we've witnessed in the first few weeks of the season. We've been dog (fecking) shit for 3/4 years...

As soon as they taste a bit success, they want it all and immediately. Human beings are also fickle

 

[izec]

I am also against buying a new player as soon as his form drops a bit. Jose should work on it. We have so much talent in the team, it is for Jose and the staff to get the best out of them and get consistency, thats what he gets paid for and to deliver titles. It is not like we have a League 1 side. Find it funny that so many wanted Mahrez, who isnt any better than Mkhi and equally as frustrating. The micro analysis and bashing of our own players is something that i just cant take well while the grass is always greener on the other side.

 

[MThomas]

He’s literally been central to 75%+ of our best play. I’d like to hear how you invisage our better play without him.

How has he "literally been central to 75%+ of our best play" ? He had few great turns in the first half yesterday, then he turned rubbish. If he stops delivering assists, his general play is miles away from being good enough to keep him in the starting lineup, he's in no way crucial to how we play.

He's difficult to comprehend as in one minute he's making a brilliant turn and passing the ball into space, and the next he completely ignores 3 players in great positions so he can run straight into two opponents and lose the ball.

 

[Di Maria's angel]

As soon as they taste a bit success, they want it all and immediately. Human beings are also fickle

And annoying.

 

[Brwned]

I think he's being criticised mostly because he doesn't fit the mould of a typical #10. What people want and what he offers are very different. Luckily for Mkhitaryan Mourinho is a bit more flexible than most.

 

[JMack1234]

Don't shout at me but his performance yesterday is exactly the reason I think we should be looking to sign Ozil up to a pre-contract when we're allowed to in January.

Yeah there are questions about Ozil but firstly I think questions regarding his attitude and largely amplified because football is a soap opera and Arsenal is currently one of the main storylines which causes their players to be forced under the most unforgiving microscope. This is a guy who is a staple of a extremely dominate German national team. Secondly he has worked with Mourinho before and they have a good relationship and lastly it'll give Mata and Micky a rocket for the 2nd half of the season knowing that Ozil will be arriving for next season.

I really like Micky and Mata but yesterday i'd just have so much more faith in Ozil to find that killer ball to Lukaku during a counter-attack than Micky.

 

[ManuMou]

It's in the past and it's time we forgot about it. What he did for Dortmund is meaningless to us.

That is your expectation. We will see.

 

[Footballsaurus]

Don't shout at me but his performance yesterday is exactly the reason I think we should be looking to sign Ozil up to a pre-contract when we're allowed to in January.

Yeah there are questions about Ozil but firstly I think questions regarding his attitude and largely amplified because football is a soap opera and Arsenal is currently one of the main storylines which causes their players to be forced under the most unforgiving microscope. This is a guy who is a staple of a extremely dominate German national team. Secondly he has worked with Mourinho before and they have a good relationship and lastly it'll give Mata and Micky a rocket for the 2nd half of the season knowing that Ozil will be arriving for next season.

I really like Micky and Mata but yesterday i'd just have so much more faith in Ozil to find that killer ball to Lukaku during a counter-attack than Micky.

Ozil is downgrade. This post appears like an agenda post. You like them both but prefer Ozil? Ozil failed, why reward failure? Are you his agent by any chance? Antione Greizmann or go home.

 

[Dobbs]

He’s literally been central to 75%+ of our best play. I’d like to hear how you invisage our better play without him.

Presumably by signing a better player?

We can't do that right now obviously but longer term I can see it happening.

Like Nani he's talented but just not a United level player.

 

[Scorpy]

Presumably by signing a better player?

We can't do that right now obviously but longer term I can see it happening.

Like Nani he's talented but just not a United level player.

That's an odd comparison. They're both pretty inconsistent, but Mkhitaryan is yet to get close to the level Nani reached at United.

 

[AdnanRED]

Agree. He took risk and failed. Unfortunately, that's what separate a good #10 from a bad one.

He better starts regaining his form, otherwise Jose will surely drop him sooner or later. He shouldn't have any complaint this time because Jose has been playing him in his favourite position #10.

One of the problems also is not really his fault but because we play quite deep and when we are on a counter if he is in 10 position Mata is usually right and cant keep up with pace on a counter so he has very limited options in the final third.

I dont know if I was the only person but when we were in for Mane i really wish we got him instead but we do need an upgrade sooner or later, Jose is doing it slowly because too much change can be bad.

 

[Brwned]

Presumably by signing a better player?

We can't do that right now obviously but longer term I can see it happening.

Like Nani he's talented but just not a United level player.

Do you think we've managed to sign an upgrade on Nani since he left? I'd think most people would agree that Nani at the beginning of this decade was as good as any wide player we've had since.

 

[Footballsaurus]

Presumably by signing a better player?

We can't do that right now obviously but longer term I can see it happening.

Like Nani he's talented but just not a United level player.

You do realize this is game six? 32 games left. He has 5 assists 1 goal, even at 1 goal per five games and 1 assist every two games, he will have a ridiculous record? ~ 8 goals 20+assists.

 

[tomaldinho1]

You do realize this is game six? 32 games left. He has 5 assists 1 goal, even at 1 goal per five games and 1 assist every two games, he will have a ridiculous record? ~ 8 goals 20+assists.

Finally a bit of perspective. Every game players go from hero to zero or vice versa because we're so knee jerk. Mkhi is a very good player when played in the middle, he's not as good as Eriksen or Silva but how many players are at the moment? And of them who could we really get?

 

[Dobbs]

That's an odd comparison. They're both pretty inconsistent, but Mkhitaryan is yet to get close to the level Nani reached at United.

Well yeah he's only been here a year. Can we not say two players are alike unless they've had the same success at the same club?

Take Mkhi's career as a whole and I think his drawbacks are very similar to Nani.

 

[Dobbs]

Do you think we've managed to sign an upgrade on Nani since he left? I'd think most people would agree that Nani at the beginning of this decade was as good as any wide player we've had since.

I think we've only signed 3 proper wide players since, Martial, Young and Di Maria. Martial I think will be a better player, he certainly had a better first season than Nani. Young obviously not and Di Maria I won't waste my breath on. Not sure what relevance poor transfer decisions has though when comparing Mkhi and Nani.

I think both players are very similar in terms of their drawbacks. Mega talented but there's just something not quite there to be truly top level. There's a flakiness to both, something that prevents them from putting it all together. As such I don't think either can be fully trusted as the very highest level. If we get back to the level of winning Champions Leagues I don't think Mkhi will be part of the first XI.

 

[whatwha]

This place is so fecking bipolar. He was in stellar form in the first few matches and everyone was frothing over him. That dips for a couple of games and all of a sudden he’s flakey and should be dropped.

With his style of play, it’s inevitable that his bad days are going to stand out because his game is about taking risks and trying to force things to happen and not a lot else. He’s an enigma and a catalyst. You have to take the rough with the smooth because over the course of the season he will net double figures in goals and double figures in assists and that’s worth putting up with.

He was never in stellar form, despite getting assists that made his stats look good.

 

[Redlyn]

I think Jose will read your post and drop Mkhi from the next game.

Don't be flippant. I don't think he will be dropped or should be dropped as we don't have a better option. My opinion still remains though.

 

[kouroux]

That is your expectation. We will see.

It's not an expectation at all, it's a fact. Different team, different league, different country, different system, different pressure= not the same levels of performances.

 

[Brwned]

I think we've only signed 3 proper wide players since, Martial, Young and Di Maria. Martial I think will be a better player, he certainly had a better first season than Nani. Young obviously not and Di Maria I won't waste my breath on. Not sure what relevance poor transfer decisions has though when comparing Mkhi and Nani.

I think both players are very similar in terms of their drawbacks. Mega talented but there's just something not quite there to be truly top level. There's a flakiness to both, something that prevents them from putting it all together. As such I don't think either can be fully trusted as the very highest level. If we get back to the level of winning Champions Leagues I don't think Mkhi will be part of the first XI.

I would've thought the struggle we've had in replacing him would indicate both how good he was and how difficult it is to find someone better. Much in the same way it would be for Mkhitaryan.

I don't think your perceptions really stack up to the evidence, personally. So in that sense I think the comparison to Mkhitaryan makes a lot of sense. Despite evidence from multiple sources that Nani was in fact good enough to not only be part of the squad at that level, but play an important role in the team, the nature of his game made it impossible for some people to acknowledge that.

Mkhitaryan and Nani are frustrating players. They take risks, they make bad decisions, they have flaky mentalities. Those particular traits act as an emotional trigger which prevent some people from acknowledging their overall contribution. Frustrating doesn't in reality mean bad, but for many they become synonymous. That's quite a flawed way of judging an attacking player in truth.

In 2011 we finshed joint-top and reached the CL final, beaten only by one of the best team's in the history of the sport by one of the finest performances in European cup final history. Nani was an essential part of the team that season. In the league he was nominated for young player of the year by the PFA, he was ranked the best player in the league by WhoScored, and he was widely acknowledged to be in our top three alongside Rooney and Vidic for the season overall. The players obviously thought so. Here's how he was described at the time in the media:

Nani has topped his outstanding season by taking home the Players’ Player of the Year prize from the official Manchester United awards night on Wednesday.

In a further nod to a remarkable campaign, the Reds' winger was voted second in the supporters' poll for the historic Sir Matt Busby Player of the Year award - just one per cent behind eventual winner Javier ‘Chicharito’ Hernandez.

These achievements cap a wonderful year for Nani, in which the Portuguese international scored 10 goals and assisted a further 18 to help United reclaim the Barclays Premier League title and reach a third Champions League final in four years.

Anyone still wondering why Manchester United are edging slowly, if unspectacularly, towards the Treble need only look to Dimitar Berbatov and Nani for an answer.

And here's how he was described by his manager...

“I don't really need to trumpet Nani's improvement. He has been consistent all season. He is a match winner. He creates goals and he scores goals.

“Every time he gets near that box you think something is going top happen. That is a great player when you get that.

“The way we are I expect us to have wide players all the time. It is the way we are. We are not going to change. The contribution our wingers have to make is not just to score but to create. In the case of Nani he is doing both at the moment.”

 

[Dobbs]

I would've thought the struggle we've had in replacing him would indicate both how good he was and how difficult it is to find someone better. Much in the same way it would be for Mkhitaryan.

I don't think your perceptions really stack up to the evidence, personally. So in that sense I think the comparison to Mkhitaryan makes a lot of sense. Despite evidence from multiple sources that Nani was in fact good enough to not only be part of the squad at that level, but play an important role in the team, the nature of his game made it impossible for some people to acknowledge that.

Mkhitaryan and Nani are frustrating players. They take risks, they make bad decisions, they have flaky mentalities. Those particular traits act as an emotional trigger which prevent some people from acknowledging their overall contribution. Frustrating doesn't in reality mean bad, but for many they become synonymous. That's quite a flawed way of judging an attacking player in truth.

In 2011 we won the league and reached the CL final, beaten only by one of the best team's in the history of the sport by one of the finest performances in European cup final history. Nani was an essential part of the team that season. In the league he was nominated for young player of the year by the PFA, he was ranked the best player in the league by WhoScored, and he was widely acknowledged to be in our top three alongside Rooney and Vidic for the season overall. The players obviously thought so. Here's how he was described at the time in the media:




And here's how he was described by his manager...

As I mentioned I think we've only signed three proper wide men since. Really don't get how signing Young and Di Maria says anything about Nani. It does confirm how poor we've been in the transfer market though.

The reality, not my perception, is that Nani was replaced whilst he was still here. Even in the 2011 season you've brought up in which he was indeed good ,Valencia took his spot come crunch time.

The talent was there, hence the positive remarks, yet he was in and out of the Manchester United team, ultimately sold in his prime and then spent the rest of his career at least one tier down. Again not my opinion or perception, that's just what happened.

That should tell you there was something missing about his game. The same ultimately will be true of Mkhitaryan. Fluctuating during his time at Dortmund, a rocky start to his United career, periods of excellence but eventually not quite good enough for the very top.

 

[Brwned]

The reality, not my perception, is that Nani was replaced whilst he was still here. Even in the 2011 season you've brought up in which he was indeed good ,Valencia took his spot come crunch time.

That's a nice story to tell yourself but again, it doesn't stack up with the evidence.

Nani started 31 league games and was one of only three outfield players to start over 30 games, alongside Vidic and Evra. The next closest was Rooney on 25.

He started in 13 of the last 18 games in all competitions between March and May, including the FA Cup semi-final, the Champions League semi-final and the last league game of the season. If not for Carragher's horror tackle he'd likely have started the first 2 games of April too, meaning he'd have only missed three games in the last three months of the season.

So really what you're judging him on is one game - the Champions League final. Even on that front you've got the story wrong. He was never replaced by Valencia. He was replaced by Park for a specific tactical role, which ultimately left us pretty toothless. In the Champions League semi, the FA Cup semi and most league games following his comeback, Valencia and Nani played together.

In other words, it is all about perceptions.

 

[Deleted member 101472]

I think he's done okay personally. I think mourinho likes him for his directness, usually when he picks the ball up he carries it forward and away from our defence which I'm sure mourinho likes.

 

[Harry190]

He has talent. That much is evident. On his day, unplayable. Has already done it twice at United. But two or three out of 50 is worrying.

 

[AshRK]

I don't think he is world class, he is a very good player on his day but his decision making is atrocious sometimes. He has to be more clinical with his decision making if we are to win the league. Like in big games he cannot take 4 chances to get it right. Mata and mkhi must improve or we have to look for upgrading them.

 

[BeforeKeanetherewasRobson]

You do realize this is game six? 32 games left. He has 5 assists 1 goal, even at 1 goal per five games and 1 assist every two games, he will have a ridiculous record? ~ 8 goals 20+assists.

On a pure stats basis, agree his record looks ok/good and if you could extrapolate that across a season (which is a big if), it's be a very good return.

The issue I have (and some others) is the rest of his game looks average/poor... making the right runs to drag opposition players away from Lukaku, playing others into dangerous areas, tracking back (say like Mata does), keeping possession with an easy pass when nothing else is on, etc.

While he's adding to the goals (directly or indirectly), people will be ok but if (another if I grant you) the assists/goals don't carry on on this rate, I don't think he offers enough in the other areas of his game to be a contributor to a trophy/title chasing team.

As you say, early days this season (though my opinion hasn't changed from what I saw last season) so let's give it another 12 matches or so. If he has the pro-data number of assists and goals, great (for the team).... if they drop off and off-the-ball/possession input still isn't there, see no place for him.