edit: posted in main forum
15
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
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Yeah, he's a horrible human being.
Just shows that talent is only half the equation. You can't teach heart and desire.
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Christ.
Superb evaluation
any chance he'll play today?
Gulag imo.
nope gonna play with u21s on monday night
Can pretty much cement any attacking position if he strings a few good performances at this rate.
BTW, is there any compilation of his home performance vs Newcastle in 2013?
Sending Januzaj on loan is quite possibly the weirdest thing LVG has done. I still can't get over how utterly stupid it was. In his only 2 games with us, he scored the winner against Villa after a beautiful turn and proceeded to play two excellent through balls against Newcastle which should have resulted in a winner if not for the Depay being shit and the ref.
Hopefully LVG stops being stubborn and gives him the same amount of chances and patience as Depay. I have no doubt he'll come good given the chances.
Hopefully LVG stops being stubborn and gives him the same amount of chances and patience as Depay. I have no doubt he'll come good given the chances.
Well, that's pretty harsh from Tuchel. I do think that Januzaj probably realized very early that the competition would be too tough for him.
So maybe he just didn't give his 100% since he couldn't expect to get more playing time anyway.
We had a situation like that also with a Kalas loan to Cologne. When we loaned him out Cologne had one of the best defensives in the league. There was no reason for the Cologne manager to bring Kalas into the team. So we had player with CL experience who was loaned to a minor team in the Bundesliga and could't get a game. Compared to that Januzaj did actually better.
You should probably do a bit more research before you say silly things.
Like what?
He started 4 games for us this season and was pretty poor. He wasn't going to feature in every match and it was decided it would be better for his development if he went on loan. He chose Dortmund despite advice from LVG to choose a club that will start him every game and LVG decided to let him go there and learn the hard way.
He's got a lot to improve before he's worthy of starting regularly for us and if his attitude is as multiple reports and coaches say it is, sending him to a bottom half EPL side against his wishes would only serve to bring the worst out of him.
He'll have hopefully learnt a big lesson in Dortmund and will realise where he actually sits on the football ladder right now. Time for him to get his head down and train hard to save his career. He'll only have himself to blame if he doesn't make it.
People are being a tad overly dramatic with Januzaj's situation. Let's not forget that he's just 20 years old. He's still quite ahead in his development even compared to other big talents at his age. Sitting on the bench at Dortmund for 4 months has hardly put him in a position where he has to "save his career" or anything like that.
I completely forgot about the Brugge games so fair enough but I don't agree about the PL games. He's still inconsistent within games but in both games he produced moments of real quality.
For me he's the kind of player that needs to get a run of game to prosper and he really hasn't had that since LVG has been here. He hasn't even had consistency in the position he plays in.
For me he's the kind of player that needs to get a run of game to prosper and he really hasn't had that since LVG has been here. He hasn't even had consistency in the position he plays in.
Hang on, you can't excuse him for spitting the dummy at that situation. That (his not yours) is a terrible attitude to have and to approach any opportunity with.
Tuchel's quote is too sensored if anything. Januzaj needs to be hit with the cold, hard truth and have his outlook questioned in a more severe fashion by all around him if that truly was his attitude to it all.
The point I was trying to make is that Dortmund's attack was working pretty well even without Januzaj. So him giving 110% in training probably wouldn't have changed his situation a lot. That's why I made the comparison with Kalas and the Cologne loan deal.
Of course he is probably too pampered and his immediate environment most likely feeds his ego as being destined to be a star. But that's just the reality of a footballer's life nowadays. He won't suddenly put on a Vardy-attitude.
Of course he is probably too pampered and his immediate environment most likely feeds his ego as being destined to be a star. But that's just the reality of a footballer's life nowadays. He won't suddenly put on a Vardy-attitude.
Hopefully now the kid really knuckles down and works hard on becoming the player he can become over the next 2-3 years.
But I also think he might be someone who needs a manager putting more faith in him than LVG does. I'd love LVG to persist and trust his talent the way he's done with Memphis for the last 5 months. I'm hoping to see Januzaj's game explode into life under the next manager, if he struggles under LVG this season.
That wouldn't make it any better, would it? I mean first of all he's not just training for Dortmund, but also for himself, so not putting in the full effort is stupid either way. Secondly even his ego is a big inflated surely he could not have expected to be getting regular starts for a club like Dortmund, especially as a loan player? And it's not like Dortmund's first XI played every minute. Reus had some injury troubles again, Castro needed some time to adapt and Ramos' quality can and should be seriously doubted. There were plenty of minutes up for grabs.
I still think he could easily have been an important sub for Dortmund, with his talent and the kind of freedom Dortmund gives to their attackers he could've been great.
Am i the only one who reads that as, Dortmund wanted him on loan not only as cover but as a potential transfer, where'as Januzaj was treating it solely as a loan move to gain experience at a top club hoping to play more regularly(stupidly). so once it became pretty clear he wasn't in it for the long term at dortmund they didnt want to waste the squad spots bedding him in and progressing a young player that they weren't going to benefit from?
Obviously there are tons of different opinions on this subject. However, I have yet to read one that truly encompasses all that has gone wrong with Adnan.
I think there is plenty of blame to go around and each party has had a hand in what I would call an absolute debacle. In order to understand, we must look at all the facts and be willing to go back to when the player arrived at United.
Januzaj arrived at United in 2011 - since that time he has played for the U18's, U21's, been on the bench and been a part of first team sessions with Sir Alex, David Moyes, Ryan Giggs and LVG, Tuchel and Wilmots. In his 4 + years with the club he has had essentially 6 managers within United and 2 outside United. As a young player with a budding talent one of the most important things is structure and repetition - he has had very little of either. With every manager comes a different message, a different way of playing, different expectations and a different...dare I say, "philosophy." This is a disaster scenario for a young kid trying to find his feet within one of the biggest clubs in the world.
I watched this kid not even 4 years ago in a tournament called the Dallas Cup - a U19 youth tournament. He was absolutely bored and miles ahead of any other player at that tournament - this tournament is viewed as one of the best youth tournaments in the world. Less than 6 months after that he was carrying the United first team - albeit a very poor United first team.
Add to that the fact that kids of this talent need veterans around them to help guide them and make sure that they stay on the correct path. Well, ever since he became a true first team player, we have managed to get rid of Ferdinand, Vidic, Evra, Fletcher, Nani, RVP, Chicharito - all players that know what it means to play for United and are ingrained in the steep tradition and expectations of the club. In all reality, Carrick and Rooney are the only players in the current squad that bleed red - Carrick's role has been drastically reduced and Rooney has had his own issues to deal with.
I wrote a long winded post in the "direction of the club" thread - and my sentiments written then hold true for this situation as well. Our club has changed - some might say for the better and some might say for the worse. We are a buying club in which every player in on edge that we might purchase a player to take their place within the team. This is a far cry from the Sir Alex days where older players were vested in helping younger players move up the ladder as they knew who would eventually replace them. The ones that suffer are the young players.
Adnan certainly isn't innocent in all of this either but in the end he is a talented 20 year old that brims with confidence. A confidence that tells him he could play in any team - this is not abnormal for a young superstar.
However, I place most of the blame on his "camp" as they have obviously given him very bad advice. He needs new people within his personal team - he needs someone that isn't afraid to say the difficult things to him.
Between his camp, the instability within the club and his own personal decisions this thing has become a mess. I just hope he is able to regain his confidence. Some of that might come with maturity but some of it is going to have to come from stability and structure within the club. My guess is that he will be able to add another manager he has played for to his list very soon.
Not an ideal situation - but also not one that is ideal for bringing youngsters to the next level.
I think there is plenty of blame to go around and each party has had a hand in what I would call an absolute debacle. In order to understand, we must look at all the facts and be willing to go back to when the player arrived at United.
Januzaj arrived at United in 2011 - since that time he has played for the U18's, U21's, been on the bench and been a part of first team sessions with Sir Alex, David Moyes, Ryan Giggs and LVG, Tuchel and Wilmots. In his 4 + years with the club he has had essentially 6 managers within United and 2 outside United. As a young player with a budding talent one of the most important things is structure and repetition - he has had very little of either. With every manager comes a different message, a different way of playing, different expectations and a different...dare I say, "philosophy." This is a disaster scenario for a young kid trying to find his feet within one of the biggest clubs in the world.
I watched this kid not even 4 years ago in a tournament called the Dallas Cup - a U19 youth tournament. He was absolutely bored and miles ahead of any other player at that tournament - this tournament is viewed as one of the best youth tournaments in the world. Less than 6 months after that he was carrying the United first team - albeit a very poor United first team.
Add to that the fact that kids of this talent need veterans around them to help guide them and make sure that they stay on the correct path. Well, ever since he became a true first team player, we have managed to get rid of Ferdinand, Vidic, Evra, Fletcher, Nani, RVP, Chicharito - all players that know what it means to play for United and are ingrained in the steep tradition and expectations of the club. In all reality, Carrick and Rooney are the only players in the current squad that bleed red - Carrick's role has been drastically reduced and Rooney has had his own issues to deal with.
I wrote a long winded post in the "direction of the club" thread - and my sentiments written then hold true for this situation as well. Our club has changed - some might say for the better and some might say for the worse. We are a buying club in which every player in on edge that we might purchase a player to take their place within the team. This is a far cry from the Sir Alex days where older players were vested in helping younger players move up the ladder as they knew who would eventually replace them. The ones that suffer are the young players.
Adnan certainly isn't innocent in all of this either but in the end he is a talented 20 year old that brims with confidence. A confidence that tells him he could play in any team - this is not abnormal for a young superstar.
However, I place most of the blame on his "camp" as they have obviously given him very bad advice. He needs new people within his personal team - he needs someone that isn't afraid to say the difficult things to him.
Between his camp, the instability within the club and his own personal decisions this thing has become a mess. I just hope he is able to regain his confidence. Some of that might come with maturity but some of it is going to have to come from stability and structure within the club. My guess is that he will be able to add another manager he has played for to his list very soon.
Not an ideal situation - but also not one that is ideal for bringing youngsters to the next level.
Glad you're not a scout. Jesse Lingard who's ceiling is an Ashley Young type player. No thanks i'd chance things with Adnan every day of the week.
And Adnan can be compared to Adam Johnson in that case...
You should start paying more attention to the youth teams.
Which, ironically, is what Johnson should not have been doing.
Adam Johnson is not a bad comparison tbf. He looked very talented as a youngster
That would've been very naive from Dortmund's side.
Not playing tonight in case anyone still figured otherwise, as per LVG's presser.
ha!
As do.ob has already stated, Tuchel would have gladly given Januzaj minutes to rest other players and therefore, a different atttitude would have changed a lot.
It is common knowledge to anyone who is interested in Thomas Tuchel - and therefore should have been known to Adnan's agents if he himself didn't care about the head coach of the club he chose to join - is that Tuchel accepts nothing less than 100% focus and ambition in training, in particular from players who were either on the bench or not even in the squad for the last match(es).
It's also known that Tuchel feels strongly that players with exceptional talent have the obligation to work hard to live up to it and doesn't hide his anger if players don't meet his expectations.
To me it seems that Januzaj not only underestimated the competition at Dortmund but also didn't know what kind of club environment he was getting into.
It is known that in case of a successful loan Dortmund wanted some kind of 'first option to buy' agreement but it's hard to imagine that Januzaj's camp didn't know about the contract the two clubs have agreed upon - but it was clear from the start that Dortmund had next to no incentive to invest into Januzaj's development.
Pulled out of the U21's squad tonight due to LvG's concerns over his fitness.
Concerning if he seems to be throwing the towel in in terms of development - does he think he's "made it" already?
Concerning if he seems to be throwing the towel in in terms of development - does he think he's "made it" already?
Won't ever make it at the highest level with that type of attitude.
Good post, @bpet15
the guy hasn't played in a month and i believe hasn't even trained since then either as he picked up a small knock. then he was on christmas holidays as per the german league, so it's no surprise he's not ready to be thrown in yet.
i don't think his attitude in this case can be questioned, it's just a matter of him needing to get back into shape. when you're 20, that doesn't take too long so it's not a cause for concern. whether he feels he's "made it already" is altogether different.
i don't think his attitude in this case can be questioned, it's just a matter of him needing to get back into shape. when you're 20, that doesn't take too long so it's not a cause for concern. whether he feels he's "made it already" is altogether different.
And do you think Tuchel's way is exclusive to him? That's how most coaches at big/bigger clubs operate. I'd say the environment at United is tougher than the environment at Dortmund. Januzaj may have underestimated the competition and most likely didn't work hard enough, but if you wanna ignore that politics went into him returning early, you must be foolish. Dortmund just as much thought they could lure him over on a potentially small fee. When it became obvious that Januzaj never had the intention of staying at Dortmund for the long term, they also didn't see the point in investing any energy in him. It was basically Januzaj being lazy but Dortmund also not caring much anymore at some point since it was clear he would not join them permanently.
What would've given Dortmund the impression that Januzaj was available for a small fee? From the looks of it he and/or United didn't want a permanent move last summer and had he done well the potential fee only would've gone up further. And what would "caring" even mean in this context? There were minutes up for grabs for him and Tuchel apparently tried to work on/with him during training sessions. But if someone (apparently) can't really be arsed and wants to leave you let him go.
It's not even like Januzaj was obviously surplus to requirements in their planning.. as of now they have Castro as their only adequate backup for Mkhitaryan, Reus and Kagawa. Hofmann and Januzaj were replaced by two kids from their u19 and Leitner, who was basically already out the door.
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